- Messages
- 16,388
- Reaction score
- 5,206
- # of dives
- 1000 - 2499
Maybe he won them like me. Or maybe cramps, like me.
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
He doesn't know yet, whether or not he gets cramps whilst diving. 
I used to but got a pair of Volos, worked great for many years and replaced them with Mares X-Streams. No splitfin vortex.
I used to but got a pair of Volos, worked great for many years and replaced them with Mares X-Streams. No splitfin vortex.
Littlerayray
Contributor
If he bought the split fins it's cuz a diveshop convinced him most likely
I applaud your enthusiasm diving can be great fun but please please please if you were having fun before the pain started take a course. Also go see a doctor get your ears checked by a professional doctor you may have done serious damage to your ears.
Welcome to scuba board and keep us posted on the conditions of your ears also let us know how and if you decide to take a course
We don't want to see anyone get hurt and that's why we are so critical
I applaud your enthusiasm diving can be great fun but please please please if you were having fun before the pain started take a course. Also go see a doctor get your ears checked by a professional doctor you may have done serious damage to your ears.
Welcome to scuba board and keep us posted on the conditions of your ears also let us know how and if you decide to take a course
We don't want to see anyone get hurt and that's why we are so critical
Kairoos
Contributor
Why would you think that? A diver isn't constantly jumping into the water, and they sure as heck aren't jumping in face first. Boat entry is usually a giant stride off the boat, or a back roll off the side of the boat, once per dive.... You could always enter the water without jumping in if you needed to.
Don't enter the water face first... If you're that inexperienced as a swimmer, don't use a wetsuit in the pool. Or at least get a weight belt and put 1lb to make you neutral while using the wetsuit.
OP REPLY>>>
I wasn't expecting all these replies. So I will go into some detail about myself, off the topic I was hoping to discuss.
Sorry for writing a book. I should probably stick this on a profile page?
I am about 43 years old. I am not athletic. I do not do group sports or exercise in general. I was the nerd in grade school. I mostly sit in a chair all day working at a computer. However I have also wanted to learn to SCUBA dive for a long time and if I am going to do that in this lifetime, I need to hurry up because the mortal clock is ticking away. And besides the exercise in the pool may help prevent early onset heart attack or stroke.
As a child, I was one of those kids with the many inner ear problems, had the drainage tube around 5-8 years old, when other kids were learning to swim. Meanwhile I was learning to stay away from water and fear it. I've stayed away from water for years, while meanwhile wondering what it'd be like to do diving someday. It is possible that Eustachian equalizing problems may prevent me from being able to SCUBA dive, but I am willing to try learning various methods to resolve this..
I am very lucky that I am not in a wheelchair. I was born without hip sockets. By wearing a brace as a baby, it seems the sockets can be coaxed to form around the exposed hip bone, and after that it all develops more or less normally. But things don't seem to be exactly right with my legs. I can't stand up for more than about 3-4 hours before my feet start to really hurt. I am forced to sit down and let the pain diminish. So I don't walk or run long distances, or do any work that requires standing for long periods of time. However exercising in water supports your body so it takes off the pressure.
I also get incredible painful lockup cramps stretching out my feet in various directions. For a long time I have avoided stretching my feet out straight such as when kneeling, because of the sudden painful cramping. Learning to swim has been quite painful from these cramps. Though lately I have found if I actually try to trigger the cramp and get it to hurt as much as possible and just bear it through it, the cramping eventually diminishes and doesn't seem come back, until I find some new novel leg movement I didn't do before that sets off a new cramp.
So me trying to learn swimming and being not panicked in deep water has not been exactly easy or enjoyable, but I am going to keep at it.
I don't see much value in swim instruction. I can find all the detailed stroke technique analysis I need on Youtube for free. I get the idea of the front crawl, but that whole trying to breathe with your head turned while water goes in your nose, makes it a bit difficult. Coordinating legs and arms is very hard, and most foot/leg positions seem either useless or minimally useful for propulsion, though II have learned how to kick and move backwards.
I don't see what good it will do to have someone yelling at me, no no no that's all wrong. I know that already.. The burning chlorinated pool water I've been drinking through my nose sort of indicated that to me.
At this point I am still not a very confident swimmer / floater, and I sink much better than I float. If I fully exhale in the deep end, I go straight to the bottom in just a lycra swimsuit, and it's a struggle to try to swim up while I continue sinking down further. Oh yeah, that is lots of "fun".
I am a bit too old for water wings, and that foam belt float the pool has, is really ugly. I find that a full surfing or slick triathlon wetsuit is much more stylish, plus it keeps me warm, and hides the flab, the scars, and the excessive graying old-person body hair. Nobody wants or needs to see any of that..
Most people can't stay in a swimming pool for more than about 90 minutes before they start getting cold and head to the hot tub. With my wetsuits I can stay in the pool for literally hours and stay warm and comfortable, in and out of the water.
I don't use weights with the wetsuit. I want the suit buoyancy so I can just focus on exercising and practicing different surface swimming techniques.
And I do not want to use lead in a community pool. I don't think plastic-coated solid lead is a good idea either, with all the kids in the pool. I am not going to risk my good name and my association with these people and their pool. But my web hunting is not finding any other weight options.
I probably will be posting something in the DIY forum section eventually. Low-carbon 316L Stainless Steel looks reasonable for making my own.
I use split fins because why not, they are better, they provide more thrust vs non-split. More efficiency for less effort. I often use them just treading water, to see how far up I can push myself out of the water and stay at that height with continuous leg motions.
I am extremely nearsighted, -10.0 diopter, which is focusing 5 inches in front of my eyes. It is very difficult to function without glasses. For a while I used daily disposable contacts in the pool, until finding this is not good in open water, where a bacteria can get trapped under them, burrow into the cornea and potentially lead to blindness. Ok, fine. I just recently bought a -10.0 snorkel mask and two models of -10.0 swim goggles.
The Valsava maneuver seems not recommended, as it has the potential to cause retinal detachment at high pressures. There is also a higher risk of detachment for very nearsighted people. I hope to learn one of the other methods, or direct conscious control to keep the Eustachian tubes open.
It is hard to do any pressure balancing practice without being in a pool with SCUBA to actually do it submerged a couple feet, just hanging there... I probably will see if I can try a PADI Discover Diving session sometime soon to practice various non-Valsava balancing methods for a few hours in a pool, under the watchful eye of an instructor. But I'm about 120 miles from anyone who runs a full dive shop with a pool like this.
Swimmers are jumping into water all the time, face first and feet first, wearing swim goggles. If you are a competitive swimmer, you stand up in the air on a platform, a couple feet higher than at the pool deck where I am, and you dive face first into the water wearing goggles. So....?
As far as head water entry wearing a snorkel mask goes, yes, hitting the water pushes them down and off your face. Have to hold them in place with one hand while jumping in. Since I am standing at the water level and bending forward entering, my face is not much higher entering the water than a SCUBA diver rolling backwards off the side of an inflatable boat. I only used the snorkel mask a few times the first day, then moved on to swim goggles after that.
It is also completely normal to jump into the water from the side of the pool wearing swim goggles and swim to the bottom to retrieve bricks and other toys. I have never seen a lifeguard tell anyone they should not do this. I do not know what you are all worked up about here.
Though there's another major problem, known as the buddy system. I do not know anyone who goes swimming or SCUBA diving regularly, so finding a "buddy" to dive with is going to be a problem. I do not know how to make myself an appealing associate to go diving with. I don't smoke, drink, or do drugs for fun. I don't enjoy going to bars. I don't go to gyms to exercise or lift weights. And I find most competitive sports like soccer, football, hockey, baseball, basketball, etc, boring as hell. Nope, I expect I'm not going to find too many athletic types to go swimming or be a diving buddy with me.
And at the moment, I'm not really interested in ice diving, cave diving, lake diving, etc. For now, as the middle-aged non-athlete slowly working on increasing stamina, I would be fine just going back to the community pool I am using now, and SCUBA diving in their 9-12 ft deep water for a couple hours at a time.
If I do manage to get certification, I will probably go straight to an air integrated computer and an ice rated regulator like the ScubaPro Mk25 Evo / G260. No point fooling with the cheap hardware, if I may need to buy the good stuff again later anyway.
Regarding the original topic:
I have been away from the water for about four days now, and my ears now feel completely normal, no pain, etc. I am going to give it a rest for a week. I probably will go visit a doc about the PADI phyiscal exam form next week to try the Discover Diving thingy, and then he can look at my ears.
I have also ordered a fitting set for the Doc's ProPlugs vented ear plugs.
And since I just love spending money on toys, I am looking at buying the IST Pro Ear mask with equalized ear cups, and see how that works. Though it is only available from IST with a prescription down to -8.0, and -10.0 is not available. Probably will check if custom lens prescriptions are possible..
I wasn't expecting all these replies. So I will go into some detail about myself, off the topic I was hoping to discuss.
Sorry for writing a book. I should probably stick this on a profile page?
I am about 43 years old. I am not athletic. I do not do group sports or exercise in general. I was the nerd in grade school. I mostly sit in a chair all day working at a computer. However I have also wanted to learn to SCUBA dive for a long time and if I am going to do that in this lifetime, I need to hurry up because the mortal clock is ticking away. And besides the exercise in the pool may help prevent early onset heart attack or stroke.
As a child, I was one of those kids with the many inner ear problems, had the drainage tube around 5-8 years old, when other kids were learning to swim. Meanwhile I was learning to stay away from water and fear it. I've stayed away from water for years, while meanwhile wondering what it'd be like to do diving someday. It is possible that Eustachian equalizing problems may prevent me from being able to SCUBA dive, but I am willing to try learning various methods to resolve this..
I am very lucky that I am not in a wheelchair. I was born without hip sockets. By wearing a brace as a baby, it seems the sockets can be coaxed to form around the exposed hip bone, and after that it all develops more or less normally. But things don't seem to be exactly right with my legs. I can't stand up for more than about 3-4 hours before my feet start to really hurt. I am forced to sit down and let the pain diminish. So I don't walk or run long distances, or do any work that requires standing for long periods of time. However exercising in water supports your body so it takes off the pressure.
I also get incredible painful lockup cramps stretching out my feet in various directions. For a long time I have avoided stretching my feet out straight such as when kneeling, because of the sudden painful cramping. Learning to swim has been quite painful from these cramps. Though lately I have found if I actually try to trigger the cramp and get it to hurt as much as possible and just bear it through it, the cramping eventually diminishes and doesn't seem come back, until I find some new novel leg movement I didn't do before that sets off a new cramp.
So me trying to learn swimming and being not panicked in deep water has not been exactly easy or enjoyable, but I am going to keep at it.
I don't see much value in swim instruction. I can find all the detailed stroke technique analysis I need on Youtube for free. I get the idea of the front crawl, but that whole trying to breathe with your head turned while water goes in your nose, makes it a bit difficult. Coordinating legs and arms is very hard, and most foot/leg positions seem either useless or minimally useful for propulsion, though II have learned how to kick and move backwards.
I don't see what good it will do to have someone yelling at me, no no no that's all wrong. I know that already.. The burning chlorinated pool water I've been drinking through my nose sort of indicated that to me.
At this point I am still not a very confident swimmer / floater, and I sink much better than I float. If I fully exhale in the deep end, I go straight to the bottom in just a lycra swimsuit, and it's a struggle to try to swim up while I continue sinking down further. Oh yeah, that is lots of "fun".
I am a bit too old for water wings, and that foam belt float the pool has, is really ugly. I find that a full surfing or slick triathlon wetsuit is much more stylish, plus it keeps me warm, and hides the flab, the scars, and the excessive graying old-person body hair. Nobody wants or needs to see any of that..
Most people can't stay in a swimming pool for more than about 90 minutes before they start getting cold and head to the hot tub. With my wetsuits I can stay in the pool for literally hours and stay warm and comfortable, in and out of the water.
I don't use weights with the wetsuit. I want the suit buoyancy so I can just focus on exercising and practicing different surface swimming techniques.
And I do not want to use lead in a community pool. I don't think plastic-coated solid lead is a good idea either, with all the kids in the pool. I am not going to risk my good name and my association with these people and their pool. But my web hunting is not finding any other weight options.
I probably will be posting something in the DIY forum section eventually. Low-carbon 316L Stainless Steel looks reasonable for making my own.
I use split fins because why not, they are better, they provide more thrust vs non-split. More efficiency for less effort. I often use them just treading water, to see how far up I can push myself out of the water and stay at that height with continuous leg motions.
I am extremely nearsighted, -10.0 diopter, which is focusing 5 inches in front of my eyes. It is very difficult to function without glasses. For a while I used daily disposable contacts in the pool, until finding this is not good in open water, where a bacteria can get trapped under them, burrow into the cornea and potentially lead to blindness. Ok, fine. I just recently bought a -10.0 snorkel mask and two models of -10.0 swim goggles.
The Valsava maneuver seems not recommended, as it has the potential to cause retinal detachment at high pressures. There is also a higher risk of detachment for very nearsighted people. I hope to learn one of the other methods, or direct conscious control to keep the Eustachian tubes open.
It is hard to do any pressure balancing practice without being in a pool with SCUBA to actually do it submerged a couple feet, just hanging there... I probably will see if I can try a PADI Discover Diving session sometime soon to practice various non-Valsava balancing methods for a few hours in a pool, under the watchful eye of an instructor. But I'm about 120 miles from anyone who runs a full dive shop with a pool like this.
Swimmers are jumping into water all the time, face first and feet first, wearing swim goggles. If you are a competitive swimmer, you stand up in the air on a platform, a couple feet higher than at the pool deck where I am, and you dive face first into the water wearing goggles. So....?
As far as head water entry wearing a snorkel mask goes, yes, hitting the water pushes them down and off your face. Have to hold them in place with one hand while jumping in. Since I am standing at the water level and bending forward entering, my face is not much higher entering the water than a SCUBA diver rolling backwards off the side of an inflatable boat. I only used the snorkel mask a few times the first day, then moved on to swim goggles after that.
It is also completely normal to jump into the water from the side of the pool wearing swim goggles and swim to the bottom to retrieve bricks and other toys. I have never seen a lifeguard tell anyone they should not do this. I do not know what you are all worked up about here.
Though there's another major problem, known as the buddy system. I do not know anyone who goes swimming or SCUBA diving regularly, so finding a "buddy" to dive with is going to be a problem. I do not know how to make myself an appealing associate to go diving with. I don't smoke, drink, or do drugs for fun. I don't enjoy going to bars. I don't go to gyms to exercise or lift weights. And I find most competitive sports like soccer, football, hockey, baseball, basketball, etc, boring as hell. Nope, I expect I'm not going to find too many athletic types to go swimming or be a diving buddy with me.
And at the moment, I'm not really interested in ice diving, cave diving, lake diving, etc. For now, as the middle-aged non-athlete slowly working on increasing stamina, I would be fine just going back to the community pool I am using now, and SCUBA diving in their 9-12 ft deep water for a couple hours at a time.
If I do manage to get certification, I will probably go straight to an air integrated computer and an ice rated regulator like the ScubaPro Mk25 Evo / G260. No point fooling with the cheap hardware, if I may need to buy the good stuff again later anyway.
Regarding the original topic:
I have been away from the water for about four days now, and my ears now feel completely normal, no pain, etc. I am going to give it a rest for a week. I probably will go visit a doc about the PADI phyiscal exam form next week to try the Discover Diving thingy, and then he can look at my ears.
I have also ordered a fitting set for the Doc's ProPlugs vented ear plugs.
And since I just love spending money on toys, I am looking at buying the IST Pro Ear mask with equalized ear cups, and see how that works. Though it is only available from IST with a prescription down to -8.0, and -10.0 is not available. Probably will check if custom lens prescriptions are possible..
Last edited:
And before anyone says "Wow, after reading that, I would disqualify you from ever learning to SCUBA dive", there are wheelchair bound people who are permitted to get dive certification..
My main point listing all this is that I know my limits, and I'm not going to be diving 60 ft deep the first day just because the base open water certification allows it. I have no plans to go much deeper than 12 feet until I can get the inner ear equalization methods figured out and working reliably..
I am capable of back-floating across a pool without a wetsuit, or using mask/snorkel/fins, and can float for ten minutes by shallow breathing off the top of my lungs. That's really about all the PADI base qualification requires, plus the doctor sign-off for 40+ year olds..
My main point listing all this is that I know my limits, and I'm not going to be diving 60 ft deep the first day just because the base open water certification allows it. I have no plans to go much deeper than 12 feet until I can get the inner ear equalization methods figured out and working reliably..
I am capable of back-floating across a pool without a wetsuit, or using mask/snorkel/fins, and can float for ten minutes by shallow breathing off the top of my lungs. That's really about all the PADI base qualification requires, plus the doctor sign-off for 40+ year olds..
You have done a lot of reading, and you have learned a lot. You have not learned as much as you think you have, though. Your long explanation includes some misunderstandings about what you learned. Rather than struggle through them here, I am going to suggest instead that you find a good, experienced, patient, local instructor in your area and work with him or her. Discover Scuba sessions are frequently handled by the least experienced employees in a shop.
I would echo that sentiment.
There are a number of things that you appear to be not quite 100% on that could be causing you issues so, as Boulderjohn suggests, I would look for an experienced instructor who will help you out by teaching in a way that works for you (I might suggest that a group class may not be the best route for you due to the mobility issues etc). There certainly sounds no reason why you can't dive but you probably need more assistance in modifying techniques to suit your situation than most
About a year ago, I sent some emails to a local (40 miles away) SCUBA instructor who doesn't have a shop, talking about these things. The local response has not been too enthusiastic:
Very odd, how do those handicapped people manage to get certified at all then?
I really don’t think you can pass the water skills part of the training and testing. The standards require that NO swimming aids can be used. Wet suits are considered a swim aid. I would hate to get your hopes up and say all kinds of good things and then pass you on the knowledge that you are a poor swimmer just to get your money and then have something bad go against you when you dive after the certification. I am somewhat flexible with the course but I do not cut or slack on the requirements period. This would also go on fudging on the medical statement that each student has to complete. If I am aware of a problem and something should happen then I am at full liability for that accident. Bottom line is if you are a poor swimmer and you drown while diving after I certify you I am responsible. The courts in a lawsuit would assume that I was in the business for just the money. Sorry I cannot help you at this time.
Very odd, how do those handicapped people manage to get certified at all then?
Similar threads
