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HDVs not benchmarked at tahoe

Discussion in 'Halcyon' started by ScubaFeenD, Jul 20, 2011.

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  1. ScubaFeenD

    ScubaFeenD Marine Scientist

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Baltimore, MD
    So I am in the market to get a scooter, and have been for a bit. I had gotten a lot of advice regarding scooters, and I thought that since there will be another tahoe benchmark this year I would use those results to evaluate my best options. Based on some positive personal reviews the HDV16 ranked highly on my list of potential buys.

    So, this morning I looked on the tahoe benchmark site (http://www.tahoebenchmark.com/2011.htm) and it indicates that not only have suex opted out of tested but so has Halcyon. Why is this? Halcyon typically makes a superior product in many categories, and the exclusion despite invitation is suspect. Even if you dont have the fastest and most powerful scooter why not just take part to prove the specs you claim are true.

    I was starting to be swayed by the hype regarding the halcyon, but I feel a bit discouraged by this turn of events. It only makes me question what Halcyon is hiding that they dont want it tested.

    Perhaps someone can enlighten me.
  2. HalcyonMFG

    HalcyonMFG Dive Equipment Manufacturer

    “Halcyon Manufacturing receives regular requests to test many of its products. Each request is evaluated as to the specifics of the test, the cost and the benefit for Halcyon and its customers. The Tahoe test, while popular among a small segment of the diving community, unfortunately did not meet the criteria for approval the past few years. We will evaluate each year as necessary. Bench test data on the Halcyon HDV units including thrust along with other specifications can be found at - http://www.halcyon.net/hdv.”

    Good Diving
  3. japan-diver

    japan-diver Dive Charter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Okinawa, Japan
    I have tested many scooters side by side including the Halycon and I find the Xscooters beating them in run time by a huge margin, thrust and speed by a noticeable difference and price. I think Halycon is afraid of these shortcoming being shown in a unbiased test. The SS Magnums also beats them in the same way. Hopefully a Halycon owner will bring a scooter to Tahoe. I find a company that will not allow its products to be tested is usually afraid of the results.
    BB1 likes this.
  4. ScubaFeenD

    ScubaFeenD Marine Scientist

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Baltimore, MD
    That is what i suspect it going on even though I dont personally think that should be the case. I dont expect halcyon to win in a match of speed or even battery burn time. I think that they can justify the much higher price with the many other features offered on the scooter--certainly they have lead me to seriously consider paying much more. However, there is no way to verify any of their claims unless you buy one and do your own testing. It is not transparent.

    I have actually heard that the runtimes can be much longer than posted and even the speed be greater than posted (all with drysuit and doubles on), but Ill never really know because there is not way to verify other than word of mouth.
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2011
  5. a22shady

    a22shady Contributor

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: New Jersey
    I agree it's trully dissapointing that they will not send there scooters there to be ran in the test. I think these tests are not about winning or loosing but evaluating each scooter in the same test to find out what it can do. I am very interested in seeing there scooters at the even to get some actual data. All manufactures have claims on what there equipment will do it's to get it out and be tested to see how close the numbers trully are in an equal test. This helps us consumers evaluate more of what we are getting and let the current users know what they have and the capabilities.
  6. DiverLaura

    DiverLaura Dive Equipment Manufacturer

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: From the edge of the deep green sea
    You are comparing apples to oranges. The Dive Xtras CUDA and SS Magnus are designed to 'compete' on a different scale (with each other and the XK1/2). If you want to compared apples to apples, then compare the Halcyon scooters to the Sierra, N19, Gavin, etc...

    Indeed it is nice to have a bit more giddyup at times, but i find the majority of the time i run my CUDA at 'standard scooter speeds'. Why?
    a) it gets a bit painful to ride long duration at top in speed
    b) shorter duration at top speed due to high draw for those of us who don't have Lithium packs.
    c) at the end of the day, more folks still have sierra/gavin/n19 speed scooters than CUDA's. All it takes is one "regular" scooter and no mattter how many CUDA or Magnus you have in the group, the group goes 'regular scooter' speed.

    There are many other factors that I would recommend taking into account over top end speed. Its highly recommended to get out and ride the scooters and see how they 'feel' to you.

    In my experience with the HDV T-16 and R-14, they are some of the most delightful scooters I've ridden to date. Both scooters track like a much larger scooter and there is basically zero strain or effort on the hand or trigger finger whilst riding. They are both 'fast' for standard speed scoots and the infinite dial-ability of the T-16 speed setting is quite nice for matching speeds and shooting video. They are both perfectly balanced out of the box for fresh and salt, which is a real pleasure in itself (if you've ever spent time balancing a scooter, you know what i'm talking about) and the ease of 'getting them out the door' is such that if faced with stuffing the battery into my CUDA tube and making triple sure the C-clip is locked vs. unplugging the charger and putting the lid on either of the HDV's, if i'm in any kind of hurry, i found myself grabbing the HDV, choosing ease of use over 'speed'.

    other than bragging rights, there are only a small handful of dives out here in my area where I personally have found the extra power desirable. Yes, its fun blasting past your dive buddy who has a standard speed scooter from time to time, but for real life diving, ALL scooters are fun :)

    I often wonder from time to time if some of the folks who've gone and bought a CUDA right out of the gate, put 5 or 6 dives on it before selling it off at a loss would have found starting with a Sierra or HDV R14 more enjoyable and less of a rodeo.

    and Yes, to those jumping up and saying 'bias bias bias', of course i'm biased, but i also have a CUDA mini and 650 tube, and i ride the scooter that 'does the job' for the task at hand. If i'm out doing demos and i want folks to have the best experience possible, unless they are already a bit experienced with scooters, i hand them one of the HDV's because i WANT them to have fun, i WANT them to want a scooter... I don't want them to feel like they are fighting to control the scooter.... on the flip side, if its an experienced scooter pilot and i want them to have a bit of a thrill, i hand off the CUDA... (as long as i've taken the time to get her balanced) <grin>

    a quick note regarding price... For what you get, the R14 is actually a great price for a lightweight recreational scooter (a no frills entry level scooter that can also happily pull doubles around)

  7. Rainer

    Rainer DIR Practitioner

    I know someone who has one. I sent him a message to see if he can't loan his for the benchmark. Real shame Halcyon wouldn't make one available directly.
    ScubaFeenD likes this.
  8. DiverLaura

    DiverLaura Dive Equipment Manufacturer

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: From the edge of the deep green sea
    The powers that be at Halcyon have been following this thread and are taking the input into consideration... At this juncture, the thread will be closed. :) thanks for understanding!
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