How Can I Try a BP/W Setup?

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When it comes to weights I assume the SS backplate will count for some of my weight. How do you attach other weights if needed? Weightbelt? I saw some bolt on weights on the DSS website...does anyone use those?

A medium SS plate and harness is about -6 lbs, yes that counts as ballast.

If you need a bit more I recommend a conventional weight belt.

How easy is it to change out the tank? When I'm on a dive boat swapping tanks between dives is the process as simple as it is on standard BCD?

Really no different. We have a video on our website to illustrate the process.
Look here https://www.deepseasupply.com/templates/switchtanks.html

What's the difference between the SS backplate and the hybrid kydex/SS backplate?

If you need ballast, and I'll assume you are using a 3mm shorty and al80 tanks, the SS plate is the right choice. If you are using negative steel tanks the Kydex might be the right choice.

There is a lot of possible combinations, we make 9 back plates and 13 wings and two harnesses. Best if you call. 626-799-5078 I'd be happy to walk you through what I would recommend.

Tobin
 
Take Tobin's advice, call before you buy. The guy is full of useful information and can put you in what you need.
 
Not to mention the MSRP on a new Ranger is over $600!
 
I dive both a traditional BC (Zeagle Stiletto), and a BP/W.

They dive more the same than differently.

People on this board for whatever reason are becoming BP/W biased. Nothing wrong with that except that this prejudiced enters into advice they provide.

I am biased. My bias comes from diving various and sundry bc's over a long time - including a seaquest horsecollar, scubapro single ply jacket, sherwood vest, both good and god-awful rental stuff, homemade plate with wing of brand I don't even recall (1980 vintage), transpac, some other stuff that I've mercifully forgotten, and now dss.​

Disadvantages to BP/W
1. They are less comfortable on land.

I disagree. To each his own. BPW is more comfortable to me on land and and far more in water.​

2. They require a weight belt, or harness, or some add on ditch pockets.

Full 3mm, ss plate, torus 17, al 80. No additional ballast required for me. I think part of that is the inherent (unintended) bouyancy of a typical BCD. If I needed weight it would go on a weight belt, no sweat. My 17 y/o daughter uses 4 lbs (2 too much I think, but hey, shes comfortable with it) on a weight belt.

A bc requires a weight belt, or harness, or some add on ditch pockets or other weights of some fashion - and usually more of it than a bpw. It just happens that some or all that stuff is "integrated" - to me that reads inflexible - into the bc.​

3. One has no pockets, unless you add them.

True, but to me that is a good thing.

Slide a pocket on the belt. $12. Voila. I don't like pockets. They're a means for me to lose whatever is in them that falls out when I'm trying to get something else out. I have a pocket. It's a pita. I hardly ever use it - see above. Everything I want clips to a d-ring and tucks neatly under the harness or thru a loop of bungee.​

4. They are expensive.

Absolutely, positively not true. Full set up, nothing else required (except aforesaid pocket and some bungee that I prefer to the supplied innertube), including single tank cambands, a knife, and some cave line just in case you need it for less than $500 from Tobin, and that includes shipping. And this is not for a knock-off, poor quality rig. Tobin's stuff is the real deal, if not THE best, at the very least one of the best out there (imo). Of course, you can probably find a w(H)ing and p(H)late that is more expensive than a bc, just like I can find a bc that is way more expensive than my dss rig​
Advantages of BP/W
1. Weight distribution when diving under conditions that require a lot of weight (dry for example).

Weight distribution when diving. (leave out the qualification)​

2. Rock solid tank mounting.
3. Modular.

4. slick, slick, slick in the water. When my small, blonde, petite 17 y/o hottie, uhh, daughter wears hers (small plate, torus 17) you can hardly see the wing when facing her. In fact, she retains her natural shapeliness to the point that I'm ready to put her back in the box and continue feeding her thru the slot as opposed to letting her get on the boat with a bunch of sharks, errr... divers.

5. It fits, and I don't mean "sorta fits".

6. Did I say it was slick in the water? You're pushing a lot less grahdeaux around.​

So the question becomes, is it worth $600+ for a DSS vs. less for a nice back inflate BC. If you dive dry, or use a lot of weight IMO yes. If you are wanting a travel kit, IMO the BP/W is NOT the way to go.

When you pack a wing and plate it is FLAT and weighs about 6-7 lbs as opposed to a bc which packs like a basketball ( I know, exaggeration). If you don't like 6-7 lbs, get an aluminmum or kydex plate and check in at about a FLAT 3-4 lbs.​


Your millage may vary!

This, I agree with.

A lot of the arguments are a bunch of subjective hoohah, e.g. what is more comfortable to whom, or what constitutes expensive, what is "slick", etc.

There are, however, things that are indisputable: with bcd I need 6lbs on a belt. With BPW I need none. With bcd inflation squeezes me. With bpw it doesn't. With bcd the friggin' cummerbund sticks together every time I get ready to put it on. with bpw it doesn't.

Try'em both out, using the subjective points as things to look out for then get what you like. For me its a wing and plate. For you, whatever makes you dive most comfortably.​


hey scubastud16, how 'bout them MSU boooldawgs?
 
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A few comments...

1. The conversion to a BPW is not a 1 way street. Here and IRL there exist people that just did not care for them. You can also find some that enjoy theirs for technical dives but set it aside for lighter duty outings.

2. A BPW in and of it's self will not solve or improve your trim. Any BC that fits you and is configured right with will let you be a good diver. Gear does not make the diver assuming it fits well. Many of the BPW miracles are due to a diver having made a poor choice (or having been "sold the rack") the first time around.

3. A simple HOG style BPW is competitive with a mid to high end Jacket style BC. The price will get out of hand if you try to turn in back into a back inflate BC ala carte by adding pockets, weight pockets, padding and fuzzy dice. Decide what you want in the first place.

4. What you read on ScubaBoard is is skewed from diving in general. Part of it is a cult. Part of it is a concentration of better informed divers. Don't get caught up in the hype but make an informed decision as a consumer and diver

5. My comments are not intended to endorse any configuration or brand.

Contrary to what you read a BPW will not sure baldness, bad breath or crooked teeth. :)

Pete
 
"Contrary to what you read a BPW will not sure baldness, bad breath or crooked teeth."

You mean that guy who sold me my stuff lied???
 
1. The conversion to a BPW is not a 1 way street. Here and IRL there exist people that just did not care for them.

True, a very small minority of those who try a BP&W choose not to use them.

2. A BPW in and of it's self will not solve or improve your trim. Any BC that fits you and is configured right with will let you be a good diver. Gear does not make the diver assuming it fits well. Many of the BPW miracles are due to a diver having made a poor choice (or having been "sold the rack") the first time around.

True again, but the 6 lbs of ballast that a plate provides over the divers lungs is big help in getting trimmed out for many divers.

3. A simple HOG style BPW is competitive with a mid to high end Jacket style BC. The price will get out of hand if you try to turn in back into a back inflate BC ala carte by adding pockets, weight pockets, padding and fuzzy dice. Decide what you want in the first place.

Absolutely true. I cringe when I see people intent on "fluffing out" a nice streamline BP&W.

4. What you read on ScubaBoard is is skewed from diving in general. Part of it is a cult. Part of it is a concentration of better informed divers. Don't get caught up in the hype but make an informed decision as a consumer and diver.

No argument here. I pretty confident a well informed diver will give BP&W's fair consideration, and I very confident that a well informed BP&W buyer will find our offerings at the top of their list.

Contrary to what you read a BPW will not sure baldness, bad breath or crooked teeth. :)

No, won't cure these maladies, but the girls won't care when you show up in a BP&W:wink:

Tobin
 
Try a variety of configurations before you buy (that goes for almost anything). What works over the phone may not always work when you get your mail order home.

I don't own a single DSS product. I have seen them, and also in use. The people using them seemed content with the performance. Somewhere Tobin we have met over the years, yours is a unique name.

With the above said, I own 2 alum, 3 SS, and 1 composite BP (all of these from various mfg companies, for various reasons). The plates are configured with strapping HOG harnesses, strapping with quick connects, Deepoutdoors Matrix II harness, Dive Rite Harness, and a SP Harness. STAs - Bands single & double. The wings are OMS 98, DR Tech, SP Tech/Rec, Halcyon Donuts 60, 40, and 30. (yes over 18 years you compile a lot of stuff. lol, packrat.) Not boasting or anything, the point is what are you going to be diving (type) and what best suits you to it.

I think Tobin or anyone who uses a BPw/W would go along with the last sentence.

Note Tobin, I never turned down a manufacturers offer to try new stuff.
 
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I will rarely dive anything other than my DSS BP & wings. I have three DSS BPs and two DSS wings. If you are EVER in my neck of the woods, feel free to call me and let's go diving. My single camo wings have 500 dives on them easy.

However, I still can and do dive my Oceanic Chute II and my Zeagle Stiletto. I just feel far more stable in my DSS BP & Wing.
 
I am not even a diver (YET) so my post is not much more than filling. But you asked about "comfort"
I have tried on a DSS BP with a T-Shirt and was surprised I could barely feel it. That was my only question regarding BP's. I could save an initial cost If I were to get the sale BCD But I would not be happy. The DSS Stainless BP is going to be my first BC. And the one I hope to certify with:D
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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