How to Avoid "Guided" Dives? I don't need/want my hand held.

[KenGordon]

Even if you book a privately DM they will try to give you what they think is a “good time”. That often turns out to be showing you all the animals. Personally I quite enjoy looking for things myself, when I spot something I get a feeling of achievement. A guide showing me the same thing feels like being in a zoo, or a wildlife park. Not at all “the real thing”.

I have also met guides who are very enthusiastic about the life. I think it is important to get the balance right.

 

[Centrals]

Have to response to the title of this thread.
I have been diving just over 20yrs and yet to come across any operators that did not provide DM for the dive. The only exception was tec wreck dives.
As far as I know Dive Guide is required by law in countries like Indonesia, Malaysia, Maldives, Philippines and Thailand.

 

[tarponchik]

Have to response to the title of this thread.
I have been diving just over 20yrs and yet to come across any operators that did not provide DM for the dive. The only exception was tec wreck dives.
As far as I know Dive Guide is required by law in countries like Indonesia, Malaysia, Maldives, Philippines and Thailand.

Try Florida. Most often the DM won't go underwater with the "group". And even if he does, it is everyman for himself kind of diving.

In Maldives, the state law prohibits solo diving but there is no law for the guide. You can dive by yourselves as a group of at least 2 divers.

 

[Larryjd1]

After reading all the righteous indignation, I went back and read the OP and I believe I understand what #avengedkevinfold is looking for.

On my last trip to Hawaii this summer we had a mother-daughter pair in our dive group. With in five minutes of descending, the mother either dove over or under me three times, making contact with me each time. So, like others suggested they do as well, I moved to the back of the group. Unfortunately, the daughter's idea of buoyancy control was to continually fin in a vertical position - not so good for viz when you are behind her near the bottom.

So maybe "moronic" wasn't the right word to use, but there are plenty of postings about whether or not training is to lax - and people shouldn't have to pay for private charters and dive guides because others don't learn proper techniques or display common courtesy.

I will also be diving Grand Caymen two weeks from now for the first time and I know from researching that at least some operators will allow you to do you break from the group so long as you have a buddy. Unfortunately, my son who usually is my buddy won't be on this trip, so #avengedkevinfold, if you want to DM me I'll be happy to share what I have found and I'd be fine budding with you if it worked out that we are there at the same time

 

[bowlofpetunias]

As usual SB members came up with some great suggestions that should give people the best chance of having memorable dives for the right reasons.

"Calling it like it is" can be done politely which is less likely to have people get "panties in a knot" sidetracking the thread from addressing the problem the OP wanted solved. SB focuses on being a friendly forum which is probably why it attracts such a wide international membership including us "Polite Canadians ehh?"

I'm glad you posted about this problem that frustrates so many of us. It looks like you may have even found a good potential dive buddy.

In areas like Queensland and some Marine Parks you have to dive with a DM. We have found most of the time after the first dive the operators tend to regroup people and often let us do out own thing.

We also consider the first dive a chance to check out the DM. DM's approached tactfully can often become great assets. Of course it is always best to approach in a positive way. If that fails we have use the "Starburst" DM training technique. Our group of experienced divers go to the bottom and all head in opposite directions but stay in visual range of the DM. We give the DM time to absorb what is happening then we regroup. We've only done that a couple times but the DM certainly stopped rushing about trying to force us to play catch up not allowing time to look at things or take pics.

Their job has two parts. First is to keep us and the environment safe. Second part is to make sure we get the kind of experience we paid for. Once they realize the divers have appropriate skills and are following safe practices they sometimes need help understanding how they can achieve the second part of the job.

 

[Centrals]

Try Florida. Most often the DM won't go underwater with the "group". And even if he does, it is everyman for himself kind of diving.

In Maldives, the state law prohibits solo diving but there is no law for the guide. You can dive by yourselves as a group of at least 2 divers.

1. To dive outside the "Coral Triangle" is a bit late for me.
2. Only been to Maldives twice on LoB and could not recall your kind of practice was allowed or even mentioned.

 

[Centrals]

It depends on where you go. Not all locations even allow you to be in the water without a DM, but if you are paying for your private DM, then you get to choose the shots.
The top options are clear, but they do NOT include bitching about the other divers and wanting to have everything your own way. That is childish, narcissistic, selfish, and unrealistic. Better options are:
1. Choose your locations so you don't even need a guide...or a buddy.....like shore diving in Bonaire.
2. Check with the operators first rather than complaining afterwards.
3. Pay for exactly what you want -- private boat, private DM if needed.

The main issue is some divers do not want to pay top money for the service! They only know how to complain/moan afterwards or even before the trip etc etc.
I was once buddied with a 14yrs old girl and limited to 18m. It didn't bother me a bit because I knew the area was mainly for inexperienced divers. The dive went very well and the girl was competent, no need for any assistance including climbing back to the boat fully kit(minus the fins only).

 

[Jungle Diver]

Most places I worked in the world were marine parks where you needed to dive with a guide that has been certified by the park authorities to guide divers in a safe and eco-responsible manner. Also many dive shop and dive boat insurances won't cover incidents if divers are not guided by a certified DM, I've been in places where only certified instructors can guide divers.

As a photographer the best option is to hire a private guide, he'll know the areas much better than you ever will and know where all the goodies are at and point them out for you to take all the time in the world for that perfect shot...

 

[tarponchik]

1. To dive outside the "Coral Triangle" is a bit late for me.
2. Only been to Maldives twice on LoB and could not recall your kind of practice was allowed or even mentioned.

2. We also did shore diving there so we know the rules. You can find the Maldives diving regulations online if needed.

 

[bowlofpetunias]

As @boulderjohn said earlier. Doing the research, asking the right questions in the right way can give you a better chance of getting the right dive operator for your needs.

We have generally had great luck by working with the DM. If you express your requests in a way that makes them look forward to diving with you rather than dread you as a potential problem who won't fit in.

Lets all try to present our positions in a friendly way. That way we can base the discussion on solving the problem and not getting people all worked up.