IANTD vs. ANDI

[Ari]

I am an IANTD Nitrox certified diver. Yesterday, I went into a diving club that certifies ANDI. When asking for a Nitrox tank, I was refused, as my regulator is not "Nitrox ready". They told me that ANDI requires regs to be prepared for Nitrox.

Naturally, I was looking for something in the 32%-40% area, for a very shallow 60 minutes dive. Needless to say, I was disappointed.

Is this another scam to get some money out of us poor divers?

If I am certified, why am I not trusted? I am diving Nitrox with the same equipment and have no problem.

Ari :fury:

 

[blacknet]

Hello,

No this is not a scam. ANDI follows the stricker navy standards of anything over the 23.5/25% must be o2 cleaned. A few things to ask before getting a tank.

A) What method was used to fill it? If it was premix or some of the blending machine then it's not as critical to have it 'nitrox ready'

B) gas purity.

If you put a standard regulator on an o2 clean system the the sytem is no longer o2 clean. You contaminated the system with impurities. The only thing that needs to be o2 cleaned on the regulator is the 1st stange and the hoses, NOT the second stage. (see rainreg's post about this in the arcives)

Ed

 

[Lost Yooper]

Yes, it's a scam of the first order. It's utter BS driven mostly by lawyers within an industry that is scared to death of lawsuits -- and rightfully so, as people can sue for anything AND win nowadays. Anything less than +1000% safe is just good enough for this industry, I guess. Liability is pretty much where this issue ends. Check the archives, we've been through this subject quite a bit -- makes for "interesting" reading (chickens, etc..).



Mike

 

[Ari]

Mike, I have seen and read all of the past posts on the issue, but wanted to address it again, as a channel of my disappointment.

It is clear to me, through a lot of reading, that Nitrox does not pose a real treat for use, even over 40%. Filling procedures are a different story, but that's a tank/filling equipment issue and not a reg issue.

Anyway, it is probably not only a liability thing but also a way to rip us off, just a wee bit more.

I did dive air yesterday and will continue to do so, where I can not get a Nitrox tank. Or maybe better, just stay away from places where my IANTD certification is not good enough.

And untill next time, thanks for the support.

Ari =-)

 

[Lost Yooper]

Originally posted by Ari
Anyway, it is probably not only a liability thing but also a way to rip us off, just a wee bit more.

Ari =-)

Yeah, the two can certainly work hand-in-hand to achieve their end goal ($$) . You won't hear a disagreement from me. I think I like your attitude, Ari .



Mike

 

[devjr]

Let me guess. You can only have your reg cleaned and approved by a Nitrox qualified tech for say, 100 bucks? However, it's recommended to buy a new, special reg(ahem). Of course, they recommend cleaning THAT reg every six months? hmmmm? Gettin' close?

 

[jetblast00]

As an IANTD certified Nitrox diver (and IANTD Nitrox blender) myself, my understanding is this:
any equipment must be O2 clean if it is going to come in contact with a gas mix that is greater than 40% O2 (note: 40% itself is NOT greater than 40%, 40.1% is when you have to start having things O2 clean)
If you're breathing a deco mix that is greater than 40%, then yes, your regs and hoses have to be O2 clean too.
Tanks for nitrox must be O2 clean if the fill station is going to do a partial pressure fill, where they first put in pure O2 (this is where the tanks are coming into contact with >40% O2) and then top off with another mix (usually air) Most stations will probably want your tanks O2 clean even if they fill from pre-mixed banks just for liability reasons...

I'm curious, you took your tank to get a fill, and they asked to see the regs you were going to put on it??? Then they said no, because your intended reg setup wasn't O2 clean

For use with mixes < 40%, any scuba equip is "Nitrox ready" because equip coming into contact with mixes less than 40% does not have to be O2 cleaned...

I totaly agree with your frustration, a Nitrox cert. is proof that you understand these logistics about Nitrox and oxygen saftey up to 40% (the IANTD EANx cert. ceiling)...

 

[Rick Murchison]

Aside from ANDI, all recreational Nitrox certifying agencies, NOAA, OSHA and the United States Coast Guard "allow gas mixes with oxygen up to 40% to be handled as if they were air."
NOAA Diving manual 15.11.4; OSHA 29 CFR 1910.430; USCG 46 CFR 197.452
If you believe all these folks, ANDI's position is without basis.
Rick

 

[Ari]

It is even stranger than this. I wanted to RENT a Nitrox tank and was refused, due to the fact my reg is not Nitrox ready (O2 clean).

I did do my homework and read carefully my Nitrox literature. I understand the risks and the regulations. That's whay I am so angry.

It's not a theoretical discussion, I am just looking for a shoulder to cry on, or an ear to complain to, so you guys are just what I found.

Sorry if I complain too much.

Ari :upset:

 

[blacknet]

Hello,

Sounds like they used a partial pressure setup for the tanks and didn't want the cleanliness ruined by your non-o2 cleaned regulator. Don't feel bad I would not have you use my o2 clean tank with your non-o2 cleaned reg either.

Ed