Idea for getting back without a walk through transom

[TSandM]

Interesting solution . . . I like the engine cowling handles.

We actually have a relative who works with welding and aluminum, and has volunteered to make us a ladder, so all this is very good information for us. Thanks!

 

[Md Spear]

Action Welding and Marine Fabrication of Cape Coral Florida

heres a link to the fabricators who built mine. they have a nice picture gallery of their work on all kinds of boats. the pix may give you more ideas to work with in your fabrication.

And you can also get the engine cowling handles in billet aluminum w/ powder coating in cool colors from Hardin Marine.

 

[Sea Hunt]

I like those hand rails! Where did you get them or were they custom made?

 

[mitsuguy]

So, I've been on a lot of dive boats with all sorts of different ladders and whatnot...

I'm not sure I understand the T-ladder still... The theory behind it is that you can walk up it with fins on... Um, no... I mean, can it be done, sure... But what do you do when you are back on the boat? stumble around? Especially if the "swim platform" is smaller than your fins (and on every boat pictured here, it is)? The other theory is that you stand on the ladder and pull your fins off, then get them on the boat... All of this I'm sure is perfectly fine when the seas are calm, but, when the seas get rough, there is no way this is safe - riding a ladder trying to take fins off is deadly in big seas...

You ideally want to minimize the time you are on the ladder, should the seas come up, and the best way to do that is to climb the ladder fully the second you touch it... Best ways to do this, on any boat, is to approach the ladder with your fins already off... To prevent being swept away from the boat, a simple current line leading close to the ladder should be sufficient... Its actually quite easy this way - you will (should) never see a DM handing fins up, we find a way to keep the fins and still use our hands for the ladder - usually by slipping wrists through the straps on the fins... On our small boats, no ladder at all, the captain pulls up the gear straight away, and then the floor of the boat is only about 4" out of the water, and is actually inside the boat - no tubes or transom to crawl over...

Same goes for gear on a small boat / small ladder. In big seas, it may be well easier to pull the gear over the side after you are safely on board, than to try and climb a smallish ladder.

I bring this up, simply as a reminder that just because it was flat calm when you got in the water doesn't mean it will be flat calm when you want to get out of the water. I have literally gotten in the water on a perfectly flat, albeit somewhat rainy, day, and then loaded divers back onto our boat in 8' seas...

 

[manni-yunk]

So, I've been on a lot of dive boats with all sorts of different ladders and whatnot...

I'm not sure I understand the T-ladder still... The theory behind it is that you can walk up it with fins on... Um, no... I mean, can it be done, sure... But what do you do when you are back on the boat? stumble around? Especially if the "swim platform" is smaller than your fins (and on every boat pictured here, it is)? The other theory is that you stand on the ladder and pull your fins off, then get them on the boat... All of this I'm sure is perfectly fine when the seas are calm, but, when the seas get rough, there is no way this is safe - riding a ladder trying to take fins off is deadly in big seas...

You ideally want to minimize the time you are on the ladder, should the seas come up, and the best way to do that is to climb the ladder fully the second you touch it... Best ways to do this, on any boat, is to approach the ladder with your fins already off... To prevent being swept away from the boat, a simple current line leading close to the ladder should be sufficient... Its actually quite easy this way - you will (should) never see a DM handing fins up, we find a way to keep the fins and still use our hands for the ladder - usually by slipping wrists through the straps on the fins... On our small boats, no ladder at all, the captain pulls up the gear straight away, and then the floor of the boat is only about 4" out of the water, and is actually inside the boat - no tubes or transom to crawl over...

Same goes for gear on a small boat / small ladder. In big seas, it may be well easier to pull the gear over the side after you are safely on board, than to try and climb a smallish ladder.

I bring this up, simply as a reminder that just because it was flat calm when you got in the water doesn't mean it will be flat calm when you want to get out of the water. I have literally gotten in the water on a perfectly flat, albeit somewhat rainy, day, and then loaded divers back onto our boat in 8' seas...

I strongly disagree with you.

I NEVER, EVER, EVER approach a ladder with my fins already off - and I would not do it.

I want to walk up the T style ladder and onto a platform, or into a boat, with my fins still on. THAT is the premise of the T and is a time proven concept in the NE. In other areas they might be designed differently but the value to a T ladder is to get secured and on the boat - THEN take the fins off. If you get pulled off the ladder and fall - or miss the ladder all together - I dont want t obe drifting away from an anchored boat with no fins.


A strong current is a nightmare without fins and being pulled away without your fins on can put you pretty darn far before you get them back on. Approaching the ladder with no fins seems to me to be a recipe for a problem.

 

[mitsuguy]

I strongly disagree with you.

I NEVER, EVER, EVER approach a ladder with my fins already - and I would not do it.

I want to walk up the T style ladder and onto a platform, or into a boat, with my fins still on. THAT is the premise of the T and is a time proven concept in the NE.


A strong current is a nightmare without fins and being pulled away without your fins on can put you pretty darn far before you get them back on. Approaching the ladder with no fins seems to me to be a recipe for a problem.

you didn't read did you?

I said holding on to a current line!

grab current line, pull fins off, last pull to the ladder, straight up the ladder...

if you honestly think that it is easier to get on to a boat with a t-ladder, well you need to dive on a boat with a real, strong, deep ladder... this is a time proven concept here, where, well, we deal with big seas just as much if not more than the NE...

Mind you, that ladder goes down into the water almost 4 feet and has wide flat steps... Thats not our boat, but the swim platform and ladder are the exact same, actually, the boat is the same configuration as ours, but ours has a nice big bimini... Even without someone on the boat for help, you can grab hold of a current line or the ladder, toss your fins up on the swim deck (or run your wrists through the straps), then two hands, two feet, up the ladder, then when you are on the boat, you aren't trying to take fins off on a rocking boat...

jmho, but you should try it sometime...

 

[manni-yunk]

you didn't read did you?

I said holding on to a current line!

grab current line, pull fins off, last pull to the ladder, straight up the ladder...

if you honestly think that it is easier to get on to a boat with a t-ladder, well you need to dive on a boat with a real, strong, deep ladder... this is a time proven concept here, where, well, we deal with big seas just as much if not more than the NE...

Mind you, that ladder goes down into the water almost 4 feet and has wide flat steps... Thats not our boat, but the swim platform and ladder are the exact same, actually, the boat is the same configuration as ours, but ours has a nice big bimini... Even without someone on the boat for help, you can grab hold of a current line or the ladder, toss your fins up on the swim deck (or run your wrists through the straps), then two hands, two feet, up the ladder, then when you are on the boat, you aren't trying to take fins off on a rocking boat...

jmho, but you should try it sometime...

I read it.


I just disagree. I have climbed both style ladders and I prefer the T style (as do most in the NE - based on what is prevelant on the charter dive boats up here) - perhaps it is a regional thing.

And you are mistaken if you dont think average conditions are typically worse in the NE compared to the south.

Not that the exact conditions are not present all over the world - but due to prevailing wind patterns - the NE has harsh conditions more often than many places, and with a short boating season this forces many boaters to learn to cope - or boat less often than our southern friends.

What "isnt worth it" for many areas - is considered favorable conditions for my crew and many in the NE



Anyway - even with a current line (and we have one at all times) you have to let go of it to grab the ladder - plus, people fall from ladders. I just believe that the best option is to board the boat with all of your fins on. I am having another custom ladder made from this guy now - Diving Equipment Specialties

And one of the reasons is his reputation with the charters and the style he is making me.

Even on my center console - we would use an equipment line for the BC/Tank - then board the ladder with fins on.

 

[mitsuguy]

I read it.


I just disagree. I have climbed both style ladders and I prefer the T style (as do most in the NE - based on what is prevelant on the charter dive boats up here) - perhaps it is a regional thing.

And you are mistaken if you dont think average conditions are typically worse in the NE compared to the south.

Not that the exact conditions are not present all over the world - but due to prevailing wind patterns - the NE has harsh conditions more often than many places, and with a short boating season this forces many boaters to learn to cope - or boat less often than our southern friends.

What "isnt worth it" for many areas - is considered favorable conditions for my crew and many in the NE



Anyway - even with a current line (and we have one at all times) you have to let go of it to grab the ladder - plus, people fall from ladders. I just believe that the best option is to board the boat with all of your fins on. I am having another custom ladder made from this guy now - Diving Equipment Specialties

And one of the reasons is his reputation with the charters and the style he is making me.

Even on my center console - we would use an equipment line for the BC/Tank - then board the ladder with fins on.

Perhaps it is a regional thing...

I have been told by almost every single diver on our boat that ours is the best ladder of any boat they've ever been on...

I haven't seen your boat, so I don't know, but, judging from his site, it seems he makes good things, but, round rungs on a dive ladder? Much more likely to slip off of those than a 5" deep platform ladder, with or without fins on...

versus

notice hand rails leading all the way to the bottom of the ladder, thick, heavy duty hand rails...

why would you have to let go of the current line before grabbing a hold of the ladder?

not arguing, just saying, you should try it out on a boat like ours with a low slung swim platform and a heavy aluminum ladder with handrails on both sides all the way up to the deck...

safer to take fins off trying to stand on deck of a rocking boat, or to take them off in the water???

actually, now that I am thinking about this a little more, and looking at these pictures, very few of these designs I see have any room at all on the top step for fins to actually fit... so, even if you do climb the ladder with fins on, by the time you get to the little thing sticking off the back of the transom, you have to either clumsily move/fall over the transom, or pull your fins off at the top of the ladder because there is no room for them on the top step at all...

 

[manni-yunk]

Perhaps it is a regional thing...

I have been told by almost every single diver on our boat that ours is the best ladder of any boat they've ever been on...

I haven't seen your boat, so I don't know, but, judging from his site, it seems he makes good things, but, round rungs on a dive ladder? Much more likely to slip off of those than a 5" deep platform ladder, with or without fins on...

versus

notice hand rails leading all the way to the bottom of the ladder, thick, heavy duty hand rails...

why would you have to let go of the current line before grabbing a hold of the ladder?

not arguing, just saying, you should try it out on a boat like ours with a low slung swim platform and a heavy aluminum ladder with handrails on both sides all the way up to the deck...

safer to take fins off trying to stand on deck of a rocking boat, or to take them off in the water???

Well - to be fair. You copied and pasted a small ladder that he made for a private boat to be mounted under a swim platform - then compared it to your large charter boat.


Wouldnt the more fair comparison be the ladders he made for large dive boats?


Either way - must be regional as like I said - Most dive boats have the T style up here. Im sure there is someone without it - but I dont know of any.


Maybe the regional thing has to do with the fact that there is more gear that a NE diver is likely wearing - who knows.

 

[manni-yunk]

Also - I might need to retract what I said. Most dive boats up here are modified boats that were either work boats or fishing boats.


There are VERY few that were actually designed as a dive boat - only 1 that I know of and it is a 50' Evans. I dont know what type of ladder he has and it might not be a T style ( I never dove with them), so I am not sure - but every other charter I know of has a T style.