• Welcome to ScubaBoard

  1. Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

    Benefits of registering include

    • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
    • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
    • You can make this box go away

    Joining is quick and easy. Login or Register now by clicking on the button

Is UTD still a "fringe" organization?

Discussion in 'Technical Diving' started by onepointfivethumbs, Mar 24, 2021.

  1. onepointfivethumbs

    onepointfivethumbs Registered

    # of Dives: 0 - 24
    Location: Lower Michigan
    20
    8
    I recently discovered that the manager at my LDS is a UTD Trainer. (James Mott)

    I really like the UTD "coaching" model; where the instructor evaluates your baseline and works you up to where you want to go, and can issue cards at their discretion rather than sitting through a four-day $1500 class whenever it is scheduled.

    My understanding is that there was some sort of rift between early GUE guys after WKPP and UTD ended up becoming an offshoot that practiced ratio deco, standard mixes and some other things that weren't Jablonski approved.

    Clearly at this point in my diving career any diving is good diving, but is it worth the time and expense to do the UTD training if the cards aren't recognized on the boat? I know I'd be well served to go the GUE route but that certainly requires flying somewhere to train and adds great expense, and I am not opposed to "double dipping" training with TDI or GUE to see if there are other ways to skin a cat after the fact

    I belive their model is Tech 1-2-3-Gold, where T1 is equivalent to Helitrox/DP, T2 is Normoxic Trimix with two deco bottles, and T3 is hypoxic trimix/3 deco bottles and a 75m limit, then Gold is like the GUE T2+ endorsement
     
    LanceRiley, OTF and Sam Miller III like this.
  2. tbone1004

    tbone1004 Technical Instructor ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Greenville, South Carolina, United States
    18,773
    11,280
    @onepointfivethumbs
    Do I believe UTD is a fringe organization-yes. You can't argue that point, nor can you argue that they do not have the brand recognition that organizations like GUE, TDI, and PADI have. Does it matter? Not in my opinion
    Do I believe you will struggle to get their cards recognized on a boat-you would have to ask James, but I do not believe you will have any issues as they are a "real" agency.
    Your belief in the rift is somewhat correct, but James can tell you the history from the horses mouth since he was part of the first instructor corps

    James is a friend of mine and I believe in him as a dive educator. I disagree with many things that UTD does, but you are unlikely to find a better instructor, and I can almost guarantee you won't be able to without having to fly.
     
  3. Wibble

    Wibble Contributor

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: UK
    1,251
    963
    What do you mean "not recognised on the boat"?

    You've probably got all you need already; AOW will get you on most boats (I assume!).

    UTD diving will be about taking you to the next level; superior diving way beyond that of the PADI crowd. You'll also end up diving in a "team" (UTD...) and that'll mean booking on boats with your own buddies to do the kind of diving they like (which, to be fair, is often caving).

    I've never been asked for credentials for deep diving aside from taking a course. Once you''re beyond the beginner stage, it's very much up to yourself to know whether you're qualified for a particular dive, as it's very much up to you to practice and arrange sessions with like-minded people to improve your skills.

    If you chose to move to another agency for a course, they'd all accept any UTD qualifications.


    Thinking about it, the only time I've been asked for a card was when getting a hyperoxic fill in a quarry (80% O2), but they're the exception. Never get asked when filling a rebreather O2 cylinder!
     
    Lorenzoid likes this.
  4. tbone1004

    tbone1004 Technical Instructor ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Greenville, South Carolina, United States
    18,773
    11,280
    UTD does not have any prevalence in the Florida cave community and I do not believe a big one in Mexico. You are far more likely to find the UTD teams on boats from my experience.
    GUE will not accept qualifications from any non GUE agency, but the other agencies should with no issues.
     
    LanceRiley and arthurng311 like this.
  5. onepointfivethumbs

    onepointfivethumbs Registered

    # of Dives: 0 - 24
    Location: Lower Michigan
    20
    8
    @tbone1004 thanks for the strong endorsement, I will probably swing by my LDS and have a chat next week.
     
  6. Tracy

    Tracy Tech Instructor / Captain ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Livonia, MI
    699
    438
    UTD does some things differently. That said, James is an amazing instructor and a great guy. You won't go wrong with him. You live here in Livonia?
     
    rjack321 likes this.
  7. onepointfivethumbs

    onepointfivethumbs Registered

    # of Dives: 0 - 24
    Location: Lower Michigan
    20
    8
    Farmington Hills/Novi but close!
     
  8. Wibble

    Wibble Contributor

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: UK
    1,251
    963
    Interesting. From my (ignorant) perspective, I thought they'd grown out of the caving community!

    I know by reputation they're quite strict with their standards of uniformity and they've adopted some odd manifold thing for sidemount.


    Any agency that takes skills and practice very seriously is good IMHO.
     
  9. tursiops

    tursiops Marine Scientist and Master Instructor ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: U.S. East Coast
    12,072
    10,030
    So, based on no knowledge, you presented something as fact. Got it.
    Yet another reason to suspect postings on the internet.
     
  10. Wibble

    Wibble Contributor

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: UK
    1,251
    963
    Thanks :)

    Was more posting that they had a good reputation for skills. Is that wrong too?
     

Share This Page