looking to get my first bc help please?

[-hh]

On the regulator issue..... A friend gave me a Scubapro Mark 2 1st stage and R190 2nd stage back around 1989 or 90. It has never been serviced, only hose replacement and mouthpiece replacement. It works as well today as it did in 1990. This was the least expensive regulator Scubapro made back then ( I think) and the simplest. I did at least 200 or more dives to beyond 250 feet with it, so air flow is just fine for any need you will have.

The good news is that regs have gotten tremendously better over the past 25 years and today's low-to-middle range products are competitive to the highest-end regs of a decade ago.

The Mk2 (and variants) do have a well-deserved 'bulletproof' reputation, although its internal valve design does have its HP seat assembly closed (in physical contact) when at rest, which some techs will claim will cause it to "wear" even if not used. The reality here is that the LP seat in most 2nd stages also rests on its orifice and is generally more susceptible and will need service first...but it is wise to get both serviced at the same time anyway.

In any case, the Mk2 is an unbalanced piston design and as such, caution is merited when going deep, especially if paired with an unbalanced 2nd stage (the R190 is a balanced stage), as its WOB (Work of Breathing) will increase, even if the operator doesn't happen to notice.

Today I have it on my rig for diving single tanks...

I have a Mk200 ... which is by some claims a slightly higher performance Mk2, due to a larger piston diameter, which I use on pony/stage setups. I personally found that it made for a noticable difference in WOB below 130fsw...roughly equivalent to a balanced ScubaPro 2nd Stage Regular's "VIVA" control being in the non-boost position. What promoted me personally to upgrade to a balanced 1st stage were some dives to the 130-150 range.

...and avoid a big monster console...just get the analog pressure guage, and you don't even want a boot for it. The big consoles are expensive, and they are drag and snag annoyances. Wear your computer or timer/depth guage on your wrist, and on the other wrist a compass.

Yes, do be concerned about the 'dangly' of a console hose, but the best place to position a dive computer, depth gage & compass are ultimately up to the individual to decide based on their diving environment, needs, etc. Again, the best place to start is with their most local mentoring divers because one single size doesn't fit all.

For example, there's some UW Bug Hunters who advocate keeping nothing on their wrists because they don't want anything whatsoever on their wrists because they're concerned of it snagging when they reach their hand into a hole for a nice lobster. On the other hand, some consoles really are big monsters and lack any good way to secure them to prevent them from being ugly. The decision may very well be one that is the 'least of all evils' type of decision.

Or, get the $16 small compass that fits on the watch/timer/depth guage wrist strap--they work just fine for anything except the most serious underwater navigation over huge distances.

The smaller the compass's diameter is, the less precise of a navigational aid it will be. Those tiny "pill" sized ones are barely adequate to agument natural terrain-assisted navigation in high visbility warmwater. In any case, a full size compass isn't expensive ... figure $50 max.


-hh

 

[lvxsurf]

Thanks for the info everyone. It makes alot of sence what you are saying. I know this is in the bc category but i have one more question on the regulators. I was told at the local dive shop that i would want to get a ballanced, piston, and enviroment sealed regulator. Does that sound about right to yall? Again thanks for the information the more i can learn the better.

 

[-hh]

Thanks for the info everyone. It makes alot of sence what you are saying. I know this is in the bc category but i have one more question on the regulators. I was told at the local dive shop that i would want to get a ballanced, piston, and enviroment sealed regulator. Does that sound about right to yall? Again thanks for the information the more i can learn the better.

Its pretty close.

Generally, the need for being environmentally sealed usually has to do with making sure that the regulator's 1st Stage won't freeze up when diving in cold water (& ice dives). So unless you plan on heading 1000 miles north of your home in Florida to go diving, it is probably safe to skip on that extra-cost option.


-hh

 

[halocline]

HOG regs is about as good as it gets. The DIN to Yoke adapter works just fine for regular scuba tanks.

It's nice to be enthusiastic about things, but better wait a couple of decades to see how the hog regs hold up and the customer support holds up before making any superlative claims.

Some divers find the DIN/yoke adapters to be no problem, for others (like me) they're a BIG problem because I do not enjoy getting my head wacked every time I look up. But even that's not the issue; the issue is if you are diving with yoke tanks, and there are excellent choices in regulators that fit the tanks you're using, why would you go out of your way to purchase a regulator that doesn't fit the tank valve? It makes no sense.

OTOH, I totally agree with you about the BP/W!

 

[Jim Lapenta]

If diving only yoke you can go with Edge regs like this: Welcome to UDM Aquatic Services or this one Welcome to UDM Aquatic Services

 

[halocline]

The good news is that regs have gotten tremendously better over the past 25 years and today's low-to-middle range products are competitive to the highest-end regs of a decade ago.

The Mk2 (and variants) do have a well-deserved 'bulletproof' reputation, although its internal valve design does have its HP seat assembly closed (in physical contact) when at rest, which some techs will claim will cause it to "wear" even if not used.

In any case, the Mk2 is an unbalanced piston design and as such, caution is merited when going deep, especially if paired with an unbalanced 2nd stage (the R190 is a balanced stage), as its WOB (Work of Breathing) will increase, even if the operator doesn't happen to notice.

1. I don't think that regulators have gotten much better in the last couple of decades. You do tend to see more features and high end regs, but to me regulator design pretty well peaked in the MK5/MK10/balanced adjustable/D300/G250 era. But that's just my opinion....

2. MK2s do not have the HP seat closed when not pressurized; they're just like any other first stage in that regard. I'm not sure where you got that idea.

3. Unbalanced 1st stages compensate for depth in exactly the same way as any other first stage. The IP does drop as the tank empties, which will raise the WOB with an unbalanced 2nd, but only at low tank pressures, this has nothing to do with depth. In the MK2, I notice it around 300 PSI; which is an excellent time to be on the surface! The MK2 does have less raw flow capacity than the SP balanced piston regs, but still far exceeds the capacity of 2nd stages at anything even close to recreational depth.

The R190 is an unbalanced 2nd stage. I bet that what's you meant to write.

 

[danvolker]

It's nice to be enthusiastic about things, but better wait a couple of decades to see how the hog regs hold up and the customer support holds up before making any superlative claims.

Some divers find the DIN/yoke adapters to be no problem, for others (like me) they're a BIG problem because I do not enjoy getting my head wacked every time I look up.
OTOH, I totally agree with you about the BP/W!

Ever since I did the fundies class, I get a little annoyed at how the 1st stage hits the back of my tank with any single tank configuration I can use....versus the regs config for doubles, where when you look up, your head just goes deep back into the open space, and there is nothing to hit your head....The issue here....the GUE position is of course, flat horizontal for swimming and drifiting, etc. Try lying down flat on the floor in your house....then imagine being underwater, and you want to see straight ahead...or maybe 30 degrees upward if your buddy got slightly above you. With doubles, this is easy, up to the limit of your neck flexibility, and that will be problematic for many people trying to look up much more than 20 or 30 degrees. Flat is not hard for flexibility, but with a single tank reg, the 1st stage of "many" designs hits you in the back of the head, even at flat horizontal--forget trying to look up 10 or 20 degrees.
So for single tank, I would want a really short first stage, this being the direct opposite of using a Din adaptor on a standard first stage.
The position of flat horizontal is great for ultra low drag and lower effort swimming, but many people would have a reg and config that would really make this uncomfortable!

 

[TXreefer]

Ever since I did the fundies class, I get a little annoyed at how the 1st stage hits the back of my tank with any single tank configuration I can use....versus the regs config for doubles, where when you look up, your head just goes deep back into the open space, and there is nothing to hit your head....The issue here....the GUE position is of course, flat horizontal for swimming and drifiting, etc. Try lying down flat on the floor in your house....then imagine being underwater, and you want to see straight ahead...or maybe 30 degrees upward if your buddy got slightly above you. With doubles, this is easy, up to the limit of your neck flexibility, and that will be problematic for many people trying to look up much more than 20 or 30 degrees. Flat is not hard for flexibility, but with a single tank reg, the 1st stage of "many" designs hits you in the back of the head, even at flat horizontal--forget trying to look up 10 or 20 degrees.
So for single tank, I would want a really short first stage, this being the direct opposite of using a Din adaptor on a standard first stage.
The position of flat horizontal is great for ultra low drag and lower effort swimming, but many people would have a reg and config that would really make this uncomfortable!

I do. This very thing happens to me. In fact I was lying on the floor just yesterday. I have a SP MK20. Any way I can remedy this without buying another reg? I just try to mount the tank lower but there is only so low!

 

[BClendening]

HOG regs is about as good as it gets. The DIN to Yoke adapter works just fine for regular scuba tanks. Also, there are PLENTY of recreational divers who dive a BP/W without a long hose, and many that dive WITH a long hose.

I agree with the long hose stance on things, because while I use a jacket BCD and a BP/W interchangeably depending on which I feel like toting around, or on the difficulty of the dive.

But overall, I'd take my BP/W into battle and leave the jacket at home

I fall into this category, I rock a BP/W and a long hose as a rec diver right now. I haven't had the time to get into further tech classes, but I've slowly changed my gear over to that "style" It's just one less thing I'll have to do once I can find the time and money to get into more advanced classes.

 

[Bigd2722]

I do. This very thing happens to me. In fact I was lying on the floor just yesterday. I have a SP MK20. Any way I can remedy this without buying another reg? I just try to mount the tank lower but there is only so low!

Turn the tank around 180 degrees. of course, you'll have to put up with everyone telling you it's backwards, but it dives fine like that. i did it that way for years