New member, relatively new diver - wanting own equipment

[FezUSA]

Background: OW, AOW certified diver of about 4 years with approx 80 dives, all in Roatan where I dive in shorts and a rashguard using rental shop Scubapro Pilot BCD with 6-8lb weight belt. Next year we are doing a LOB so I'm starting to gear plan!! I have bought a 3mm full suit and a pair of 3mm thick soled boots. I anticipate needing more weight to compensate!! I am looking to buy my own BCD and reg set. We plan on continuing to only do rec diving in warm water so I will either be wearing a rash guard or the 3mm suit max. Most of this will be frequent trips to Roatan with some additional LOB or other warm water trips all involving air travel, preferably with carry-on only but can check if needed. I do dabble with UW photography, currently a TG-4 in housing on a tray with a Sea&Sea single strobe, and a WA lens. I'm 5' 9" and working my way from 215 to 175lb, currently at 190! 42" chest and down to a 34" waist.

Reg: I'm looking at the Deep 6 reg set for single tank, this seems like a good choice with a price that I'm ok with

BCD: this is why I'm here! Saw the Scubapro Hydros Pro + accessories and thought that it seems great, on paper/web. Started research and found this community. The reviews here from people that dive with it all seem positive or very positive even!! Especially @stuartv who I believe is a BP/W diver that is quite satisfied with his Hydros, albeit bought at a discount!! Those that had some negative reports of actual usage seem to indicate that the issues have been fixed or refer to the lifetime warranty. Those that don't like it seem limited to BP/W folks that haven't been diving with it and really won't consider any alternative to BP/W. Researching more into their reasoning is starting to make me consider a BP/W, especially when we bring price into the mix.

Here's where I am and I'm looking for feedback/thoughts

1) Freedom plate and a wing (either the recommended VHD or something like the OxyCheq 30lb Mach V Chroma) then figure out a harness and weight pouches. Main concern is availability of plate, and minor comfort questions.
2) HOG Total Buoyancy Control System Package with 32lb soft plate + some options $450; pro's is that I still have hard plate options etc. and price seems pretty good.
3) DGX Custom Dive Rite TransPac XT Single with 35lb Voyager wing + some options $569; pro's is that I still have hard plate options etc. and price is still pretty good
4) Zeagle Express Tech Deluxe with padding kit $550; has some options available and seems to still offer flexibitility
5) Scubapro Hydros Pro with Air 2 $1049 with some options available; pro's are the positive reviews from those using it, with the biggest negative being the price and then the lack of flexibility (if that's needed)

Also considered was a TravelPac, but that seems to give me less than the TravelPac with no real advantages.

For the money I could get the HOG rig AND the Deep 6 reg for similar $ to just the Scubapro BCD, close with the Dive Rite too. Haven't priced the Freedom plate but I believe the plate is $225 and the OxyCheq wing is $400, still need a harness and weight pockets etc. Could probably do it with a cheaper wing? We do like swim throughs and tight spaces diving but have done this uses the Pilot so far. I think any of this equipment will be a significant step-up from what we've used from the rental shop!

So, I'm looking for input. I'm leaning toward either the HOG or the DGX option because that gives me an soft plate now with the option to go hard plate if needed. Or should I just be patient and put a deposit down on a Freedom and then start to figure out a harness and wing etc. I did see a post from @Eric Sedletzky on a thread somewhere where he listed his recommendations for a whole kit, but I haven't located it since. Is it pinned somewhere?

If you read this far down, thx!!

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I’ll put you down for a medium and if you want it when they’re done great, if not somebody else will snap it up.
I’m endorsing the VDH wings. Best value/quality/ feature ratio of any wing currently on the market. There is no smaller narrower profile streamlined wing better than the VDH.
You could put together an FP/VDH rig complete with harness/ cam bands/ crotch strap/ weight pouches for around $700.
That would arguably be about the most premium single tank BP/W rig on the planet.

 

[NAM001]

look in the for sale adds here there is a guy elling all he has and prices are great

Used Equipment For Sale

 

[stuartv]

If (<-- IF) you go with a Hydros, I would not get it with the Air2. There are many threads and posts here on SB about the relative merits of a "safe second" versus a normal 2nd stage regulator as your alternate, so I won't repeat all that here.

Of your options listed, I have the Freedom Contour Plate and the Hydros. They are both very good. The Freedom plate is better with aluminum tanks, because of the extra weight. The Hydros works well (for me, anyway) with a steel tank, even with my 5/4 mm wetsuit, in fresh water. I use no weights. In salt water, with board shorts or a 3/2, I expect I would still need no weight. Thus implying that, in those scenarios, I would be overweighted when using the FP.

Of course, the extra weight of the FP is not as convenient for travel. Nor is the size/shape of the FP AS convenient to pack as the Hydros (particularly, with the Hydros' travel waist belt installed).

For the same money, I would go with the Hydros. I still like it that much. But, at "normal" prices, I would go with the FP setup, all day long. So, another option is, if you're prepared to be patient, you could just wait and look out for a nice used example of either. Both do come up occasionally.

As for Zeagle, I'm not SURE if the Stiletto has it, but I really do not like the ripcord weight release setup. However, I think I am biased from teaching Open Water courses and demoing the weight pocket remove and replace a lot. I never actually dive with any ditchable weight (rarely any extra weight at all), so in real life, non-instructional situations, the weight release system probably really doesn't matter much, if at all.

Speaking of which, if I were traveling with a Hydros, I would leave those ridiculous, ginormous QR weight pockets at home and use the "travel" waist belt that comes with the Hydros. It gives a very clean, uncluttered, streamlined rig. Just like a BP/W. I would add a couple of D-rings to that (cost <$10 using parts from Dive Gear Express) to clip off stuff like a reel and/or SMB and/or camera.

 

[Colliam7]

BCD: this is why I'm here!

I will offer several thoughts on BCDs, with the caveat that they reflect MY personal preferences (and definite biases) and diving style, and MY preferences do not necessarily reflect YOUR preferences and diving style. And, my preferences come from diving, in fact owning, a fairly wide variety of BCDs, including several of those you are considering.

You are (already) using 6-8 lbs of weight with a minimal exposure suit – shorts and a rash guard. Putting aside your plans for weight loss, etc. – which may or may not affect your weighting requirements - you will be adding buoyancy with a 3mm suit and boot. Therefore, at a minimum I would go with a SS backplate, and avoid any ‘soft’ backplate units. At the same time, with a 6lb plate, you will be near optimal weighting in your warm water configuration, and need only add 1-2 lbs of ditch-able weight.

Among the equipment you are considering, the Freedom plate and VDH wing makes the most sense, in terms of functionality. I can appreciate the concerns about availability, and that is something to communicate with Eric about. If you are worried about ‘comfort’ without padding – don’t. Some divers look at a plate and immediately think that it ‘looks’ uncomfortable. It isn’t. The majority of divers that I have put into a plate – Freedom or otherwise – say ‘I feel great. I don’t even feel like there is anything there.’

The Hydros is a ‘nice’ unit. It is neutrally buoyant, which means you won’t add lead simply to compensate for the buoyancy of the BCD. And, there is an advertised element of modularity. At the same time, it is weight-integrated, and the primary weight pockets are in front of the diver midline viewed from the side (frontal plane) – which is where you DO NOT want it to be with back-inflation (it is a contributing factor to the feeling of being pushed face-down at the surface). It is unnecessarily ‘complicated’, with moulded shoulder straps, and fixed position D-rings, that offer little opportunity for adjusting to meet your needs. It is only a single cam band unit, and I find a two band unit to provide better cylinder stability. And, it is, frankly, significantly overpriced, and the value proposition doesn’t make a lot of sense

The DGX TransPac XT is also a ‘nice’ unit. Certainly, the price is far more reasonable than the Hydros. But, it is a ‘soft’ backplate and you will need to add some weight to compensate for the buoyancy of the unit itself. Like the Hydros it has a harness that unnecessarily limits your ability to position D-rings to suit your needs. As a general practice I encourage divers to avoid ‘deluxe’ harnesses. They add to cost and subtract from functionality.

The Zeagle Express Tech Deluxe has a lot of fans. The price is reasonable, and not dissimilar to the DGX unit. I liked the Express Tech better before they limited availability to the Deluxe model. It is a soft plate, and therefore doesn’t add the weight that a SS BP does. And, as with the others, you really don’t need (and probably won’t want) a ‘deluxe’ harness)From my perspective you are possibly better off getting the plate itself (Express Tech Backplate), and buying some webbing, a waist buckle and D-rings. A downside to the Zeagle is the wing – it is functional, but the configuration of the Zeagle wing is a little bit awkward for my taste.


Finally, many of the same comments apply to the HOG Total Buoyancy package. Yes, the price is certainly (more) attractive. But, avoid the unnecessary deluxe harness, the needless padding, as well as the soft plate. Forego the integrated weight system. Go with a standard harness, a metal plate, add two cam band straps, a couple of ditch-able weight pockets on the waist strap

You may sense from my comments that I generally do not favor the ‘deluxe’ packages – which add cost, and fluff, and little or no functionality. Even if you wanted a unit only for diving with shorts and a rashguard, you will not need the padding that several of these units offers (unless you plan to routinely hike several miles to and from your dive site, wearing your gear). The padding is normally unnecessary and simply adds to the amount of lead you need to wear.

If you read this far down, thx!!

i DID. You're welcome.

 

[Coztick]

I will offer several thoughts on BCDs, with the caveat that they reflect MY personal preferences (and definite biases) and diving style, and MY preferences do not necessarily reflect YOUR preferences and diving style. And, my preferences come from diving, in fact owning, a fairly wide variety of BCDs, including several of those you are considering.

You are (already) using 6-8 lbs of weight with a minimal exposure suit – shorts and a rash guard. Putting aside your plans for weight loss, etc. – which may or may not affect your weighting requirements - you will be adding buoyancy with a 3mm suit and boot. Therefore, at a minimum I would go with a SS backplate, and avoid any ‘soft’ backplate units. At the same time, with a 6lb plate, you will be near optimal weighting in your warm water configuration, and need only add 1-2 lbs of ditch-able weight.

Among the equipment you are considering, the Freedom plate and VDH wing makes the most sense, in terms of functionality. I can appreciate the concerns about availability, and that is something to communicate with Eric about. If you are worried about ‘comfort’ without padding – don’t. Some divers look at a plate and immediately think that it ‘looks’ uncomfortable. It isn’t. The majority of divers that I have put into a plate – Freedom or otherwise – say ‘I feel great. I don’t even feel like there is anything there.’

The Hydros is a ‘nice’ unit. It is neutrally buoyant, which means you won’t add lead simply to compensate for the buoyancy of the BCD. And, there is an advertised element of modularity. At the same time, it is weight-integrated, and the primary weight pockets are in front of the diver midline viewed from the side (frontal plane) – which is where you DO NOT want it to be with back-inflation (it is a contributing factor to the feeling of being pushed face-down at the surface). It is unnecessarily ‘complicated’, with moulded shoulder straps, and fixed position D-rings, that offer little opportunity for adjusting to meet your needs. It is only a single cam band unit, and I find a two band unit to provide better cylinder stability. And, it is, frankly, significantly overpriced, and the value proposition doesn’t make a lot of sense

The DGX TransPac XT is also a ‘nice’ unit. Certainly, the price is far more reasonable than the Hydros. But, it is a ‘soft’ backplate and you will need to add some weight to compensate for the buoyancy of the unit itself. Like the Hydros it has a harness that unnecessarily limits your ability to position D-rings to suit your needs. As a general practice I encourage divers to avoid ‘deluxe’ harnesses. They add to cost and subtract from functionality.

The Zeagle Express Tech Deluxe has a lot of fans. The price is reasonable, and not dissimilar to the DGX unit. I liked the Express Tech better before they limited availability to the Deluxe model. It is a soft plate, and therefore doesn’t add the weight that a SS BP does. And, as with the others, you really don’t need (and probably won’t want) a ‘deluxe’ harness)From my perspective you are possibly better off getting the plate itself (Express Tech Backplate), and buying some webbing, a waist buckle and D-rings. A downside to the Zeagle is the wing – it is functional, but the configuration of the Zeagle wing is a little bit awkward for my taste.


Finally, many of the same comments apply to the HOG Total Buoyancy package. Yes, the price is certainly (more) attractive. But, avoid the unnecessary deluxe harness, the needless padding, as well as the soft plate. Forego the integrated weight system. Go with a standard harness, a metal plate, add two cam band straps, a couple of ditch-able weight pockets on the waist strap

You may sense from my comments that I generally do not favor the ‘deluxe’ packages – which add cost, and fluff, and little or no functionality. Even if you wanted a unit only for diving with shorts and a rashguard, you will not need the padding that several of these units offers (unless you plan to routinely hike several miles to and from your dive site, wearing your gear). The padding is normally unnecessary and simply adds to the amount of lead you need to wear.i DID. You're welcome.

Well said.
I agree completely that less offers more.
A simple harness, properly adjusted, will seem like it's not even there underwater and be infinitely customizable.
What I don't agree with is hauling 5 exta pounds of plate in your luggage because you need it underwater.
By adding a couple $10 trim pockets, the lead you add can be put exactly where you need it.
I think it's Deep Six that has a "Kydex"? plate that is very light and tougher than aluminum.
I like leaving the weight on the boat.
Fwiw, I dive a utd alpha/delta without a bp in sm, but a plate can be added and the wing configured for bm.
Just a harness/hardware and wing. Quite minimalist.
Good luck which ever way you go.

Cheers" Kevin

 

[FezUSA]

Well said.
I agree completely that less offers more.
A simple harness, properly adjusted, will seem like it's not even there underwater and be infinitely customizable.
What I don't agree with is hauling 5 exta pounds of plate in your luggage because you need it underwater.
By adding a couple $10 trim pockets, the lead you add can be put exactly where you need it.
I think it's Deep Six that has a "Kydex"? plate that is very light and tougher than aluminum.
I like leaving the weight on the boat.
Fwiw, I dive a utd alpha/delta without a bp in sm, but a plate can be added and the wing configured for bm.
Just a harness/hardware and wing. Quite minimalist.
Good luck which ever way you go.

Cheers" Kevin

I'm liking what I hear about Deep 6 gear and have perused their site. Unless I'm missing something they only offer an AL and SS plate though. I'll have to use my Google-fu skills to look up Kydex and similar material BP's.

The thought line of not carrying the weight through the airport and just adding a couple of weight pouches on the back and maybe a couple more "ditchable" on the front seems like a winner. But it is also only 5lbs. Granted, when carrying my laptop and UW camera rig plus everything else it all adds up!

 

[DogDiver]

I will be changing from my Scubapro Glide Plus with Air2 to the Hydros Pro with Air2 for our CoCo View trip next spring. Been using and teaching with Air2’s for over 20 years and still believe in them. I use a 40 inch hose under my right arm with a 90 degree swivel on the regulator end to donate. Muscle memory after 20 years let’s me know exactly where my alternate reg is.

 

[Coztick]

I think I confused Deep six with DSS.(Deep Sea Supply) sorry

 

[Barnaby'sDad]

I went with the 32lb lift wing HOG BC with the soft back-plate. I've got the deluxe/fluff padded harness.

I've seen plenty of hate here about the deluxe model. I will say that if you're just going to boat dive...strap the setup on and roll off or jump off the boat...save your money and just get the minimalist setup with the basic harness. If you're planning on doing any diving at a quarry where you might have to gear up and walk 50'+ with ~50lbs strapped to your back, then padded harnesses aren't such a bad thing.

I will say though that the HOG BC straps are a complete PITA to adjust. If you're just going to order online and put it together yourself, you might want to give that some thought. No joke...I would rather run out and buy a second BC than mess with the straps on mine. I like it and I think it's a well made BC, but I'm just throwing that out there.