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NTSB CONCEPTION HEARING - THIS TUESDAY @ 10AM

Discussion in 'Accidents & Incidents' started by Ken Kurtis, Oct 19, 2020.

  1. scubadada

    scubadada Diver Staff Member ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Philadelphia and Boynton Beach
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    Thank you Frank, what an easy solution, too bad the ball has been dropped at a variety of levels.
     
  2. Ken Kurtis

    Ken Kurtis Contributor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: Beverly Hills, CA
    1,475
    1,739
    So here's a thought for our next tangent:
    The Roving Patrolperson is making the nightly rounds, comes out of the engine room at 2AM to discover that a fire has just started (let's say 30-60 seconds) in the salon area. What should he/she do and in what order: Alert the crew, alert the passengers, try to put out the fire, something else???

    Before your frame your Perfect Answer That No One Can Dispute, you might want to take a look at this video from the Oak Ridge (Tenn) Fire Department about dealing with fires and flashover. Three minutes is the magic number. You might also want to listen to what advice the fire chief has at the end:
     
    chillyinCanada and drrich2 like this.
  3. HalcyonDaze

    HalcyonDaze Contributor

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Miami
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    One would hope that a) there are smoke/heat detectors and b) there's a vessel-wide alarm that can be pulled to jolt everyone out of the racks. I would agree with the fire chief's advice that the first priority is starting the evacuation.

    I didn't sit and watch the whole NTSB presentation, but as far as I'm aware a) when the crew was alerted to the fire, the forward part of the salon was not ablaze and b) there's no indication any passengers made it up the forward stairs - is that correct?
     
    Ayisha likes this.
  4. Ayisha

    Ayisha DIR Practitioner

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Toronto, Canada
    3,139
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    Not sure why my post was quoted since I was referring to safety *after* the Red Sea Aggressor 1 tragedy, not before. Otherwise the following sentence "Perhaps too little, too late for some" would make no sense.

    Of course it's human-dependent. That's why I don't necessarily hold Aggressor fully responsible for what happened on a franchisee boat. Anyone can shine during an inspection/check-in if they know how.

    Would I want to stay on a liveaboard with the captain or remaining crew of the Conception or Red Sea Aggressor 1? Not a chance with the unsafe culture that has been exposed.
     
  5. chris kippax

    chris kippax Divemaster

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Australia
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    The marine fire fighting training I received, the instructor made it very clear that shipboard fires were in a whole different league to house fires.
    If your house is on fire you can walk out the door and walk down the street and watch it burn, that's a bit hard on a boat.

    I did my training in Tasmania, if you went in the water without exposure protection you would be dead not too long after. Evacuation to a muster point/ lifeboat area or such would be the number one priority
     
    Bob DBF likes this.
  6. KevinNM

    KevinNM DIR Practitioner

    3,025
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    It's possible to set things up so that dismounting a fire extinguisher or starting the fire pump will trigger the fire alarms all across the boat. Same way I've seen the life rings on ships hooked to the MOB alarms. The safest assumption is that anyone accessing emergency equipment is doing it because there IS an emergency.

    In this case you need to alert everyone of the fire and start firefighting immediately. You don't have a few minutes, because in a few minutes the fire will be beyond the ability of a crew without bunker gear and SCBA to fight. And it's a long swim home in cold water.

    It's unclear, due to the total loss of all the upper decks, capsizing and sinking of the vessel, where the passengers were in the boat. It's very clear that none made it out of the boat alive.
     
  7. Wookie

    Wookie Curmudgeon Apprentice ScubaBoard Business Sponsor ScubaBoard Supporter

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    Always sound the general alarm first. Ships have general alarms of some sort, even silly T boats. That rouses both crew and passengers. Then place the passengers in a place of safety. The safest place is, of course, with the life jackets on ready to disembark into the life boats/FRBs/shark feeders. Saving the ship is the very last priority, although it may be nice to have a ride home. First action, save the passengers. There is no higher standard of duty.
     
  8. Rooster59

    Rooster59 Solo Diver

    375
    221
    I stayed for a while in something like a dorm, there was a night watch that would make the rounds continually every night. There were QR barcodes pasted at all the checkpoints throughout every floor. The night watch scanned the QR codes with an iPad mini as they made their rounds. They were scanned in an order and had to be done within a proscribed time period, not too fast and not too slow. The supervisor got an automated alert if everything went haywire.
     
    shoredivr likes this.
  9. Ken Kurtis

    Ken Kurtis Contributor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: Beverly Hills, CA
    1,475
    1,739
    I think pretty much the entire interior of the salon was engulfed when the crew got on the main deck. Correct that there's no testimony or anything else to indicate that anyone made it up the stirs (or out the escape hatch).
     
    chillyinCanada likes this.
  10. Ken Kurtis

    Ken Kurtis Contributor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: Beverly Hills, CA
    1,475
    1,739
    It didn't read that way to me. Regardless . . .
    The "unsafe culture" is certainly not limited to those two crews and is more prevalent in the dive boat industry than perhaps we'd like to acknowledge. So the real question is: How do you determine if you're comfortable with the safety culture of a crew or boat BEFORE you begin your trip? (And don't forget that the RS1 passengers were assured there was a night watch.)
     

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