Obtaining OW for the Blind

[zacharydavis08]

Update,
I've sent inquiries to both a SSI dive shop about 35 miles from where I live as well as emailed HSA, asking whether either program offers the opportunity to obtain master diver cert, in their adapted programs.

*Crosses his fingers*

 

[MooreaMike]

I suggest contacting Jim Elliott of Diveheart. I am in process of training with Diveheart at an HSA instructor.

 

[flots am]

I took the full PADI OW course, all the book work, watched the videos, did all of the pool dives, and then went to do my open water test dives. Just to find out that since I cannot see a compass, I wouldn't be able to perform the final test dive, to earn my OW... To say the least I wasn't very happy, because I'm not one to let my blindness be a barrier.

The first thing you should do is go back to the place that trained you and demand a refund because they defrauded you. They knew from the moment you walked in the door that they wouldn't be able to issue you an Open Water C-Card, but they took your money anyway. It's not like you got to open water and they suddenly said "Oops! You can't read a compass. So sorry." You also can't read a pressure gauge or a depth gauge, and they knew that right up front.

This isn't to say that you can't dive, only that you were setup for failure by the dive shop.

Once you get a refund (or even without it if you don't care about the money), check into the HSA as mentioned in this thread. I don't think you'll have a problem getting certified.

Also, it's your life and only you can assess the risk. If you want to go diving with just you and your wife, and you're OK with it and she's OK with it, there's nobody in the world that can stop you. There are no SCUBA Police. Unless you're in France. Where they actually do have SCUBA police.

Go have fun!

flots.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

I've been reading this, and thinking and thinking about it. Underwater navigation is an interesting subject. Humans tend to rely upon sight, but what happens when sight is not there. It can happen in caves, which is why they always use ropes and cords to ensure they know they way out. The same goes for caves. NAUI had a publication out years ago about technology in diving, and I have a copy of it at home. In it the writer (there were different instructors for different chapters) who noted that reduced-visibility diving was any diving when the visibility was under six feet. Well, that's about all I do here in Portland, Oregon. And I do it in rivers, where there is current. So I have been thinking about this problem since the thread came out.

I have dived in zero-visibility diving. Two examples are diving for a shotgun in a dump; I did not find it, but it was feel where you go all the way. I stayed in my wet suit until I got to the apartment, stripped it off in the shower, and showered with Dial soap (which is antibacterial). My buddy did not shower right away, and got a boil from the dive. But this was gropping around with a buddy line, trying to find the shotgun. The second was a dive in a log pond to try to find a guy's dentures. He had been on the small boat, and had fallen into the water. He came up spitting and flailing (he did have his PDF on though), and spit out his dentures. I didn't find them, but was lined to the surface just in case.

Also, in the U.S. Naval School for Underwater Swimmers, we had to dive in the harbor in zero visibility with a buddy line and as a buddy team put together a piece of equipment out of a bag (we had the pieces, but had to fit it all together, a flange and plate with screws, underwater). So zero visibility diving is a definite skill which needs to be learned.

This is a photo of a diver coming out of the water in the harbor at Key West, Florida.

I have dived with a buddy line several times, and at one time it probably saved me and my buddy when we got rolled by a 20 foot wave that kicked up while we were diving.

Our girl friends were watching, and took the two above photos (one before, and one after the wave). This was a 1/4 inch nylon line with brass snap hooks, and on a 2 inch nylon webbing belt for each of us. It allowed buddy contact throughout the experience. We were out for three and a half hours before the Coast Guard picked us up. Bruce, my buddy, lost his mask, and since he needed a huge correction to see he couldn't do much visually after loosing his mask.

So I'm wondering about the underwater navigation requirement for a compass. There are other means of navigating than by compass, and these include line diving (ask cave divers). I know it is handy, but many times I dive without looking at my compass at all. I do know that we had extensive compass work in the Navy too:

So I'm just thinking out loud on this, and trying to "see" what can be done.

John

 

[tomfcrist]

Ok, your post is very thought provoking. Could you learn to dive and be certified as a diver that is dependant on a buddy/dive pro? Yes. Can you be a divemaster? I honestly dont see how.

I applaud you for trying new things and striving to participate in sports that some say is impossible, but my question is: Are you doing this to get enjoyment out of the sport, or to do it in spite of the naysayers? There is no possible way you could perform the duties of a DM competently, but i dont see an issue with you learning the responsibilites, liabilities and skills required to become one.

 

[zacharydavis08]

Sorry, I really should just go edit that initial post that says dive master... It should be to me wanting to get master scuba diver certified, not "instructor" level of dive master.

I want to be able to expand my knowledge, under water proficiency, and under water experiences through taking the courses, learning the information, gaining the confidence, and getting to enjoy a variety of types of specialty diving, that you have the chance of doing when obtaining a master scuba cert.

If I could buddy up with a DM, or some other highly certified pro, that would dedicate the time and what not, to "do the classes" unofficially that I would do if becoming a master diver, to teach and work with me on all of the abilities that I could do if I was not blind, leaving me with everything except for the certification, I would definitely jump on that, because it would accomplish 90% of my goals.

But, if it would be possible to do all of the above, in some official form, which would allow me to actually earn the certifications that would back the blind guy who's stating he's been trained in wreck/cave diving etc, that would fulfill that final 10% of my dreams.

Besides, what person would actually volunteer that many hours of their life, to do all of that training/class type work, for free, when they could be making hundreds of dollars doing it officially. On the flipside, I also would not feel very inclined to fork out thousands of dollars in "unofficial" course feas, to obtain the training/knowledge to not even have the tangible cert to validate my own training.

Hopefully that helps you more understand where I'm at, and what reasons are driving me to want to further my own diving experience/interest.

Finally, on some level I'll admit it, when I hear I can't do something it does encourage me to want to do it even more, because of that negative response. My profession is a transition counselor, for the Texas division for blind services, and I'm supposed to dedicate 40-50hrs a week working with blind kids ages 10-24, helping them realize the world is out their for them to take on, helping them become adjusted to their blindness... It just still frustrates me when barriers of this type arise, when logically there is perfectly reasonable ways around the stated issues. It's not like I'm in the DPS office raging to be allowed to try and earn a driver's license. I am simply wanting the chance to further my personal diving experience and knowledge, with the understanding that obviously I would never be doing this alone, and I'm being barred from progressing because I cannot do a task as basic as see a compass screen.

Seriously though, I've not yet decided to spend the money/risk ruining my phone, due to a faulty "water proof" case, but my final attempt will be purchasing a water proof iPhone case. Since the compass feature on the phone does not actually require data/cell service, I'm thinking there is a chance that one feature could work under water. If I purchase one of the waterproof cases, with water proof headphones, and use voice over (the iPhone's screen reading software), there is a chance I could perform the idiotic straight line navigational swim, my wife was required to do to pass her test.

Problems:
The iPhone might or might not be able to withstand pressure at 20-30 depth
The case could leak, ruining my phone
the compass actually can't work under water
The compass/voice over might not be able to auto announce course changes fast enough for me to successfully get the 25 ft from A-B

But, for all I know all of those problems listed above might end up not being an issue, and I could make that one swim. Then it would be quite interesting to see what reason PADI then would give to prevent me from earning the OW, since the only reason I was given that stopped me was the inability to perform that navigational straight line compass swim.

Sorry for the rant, it's still a sensative topic. LOL, the DM that certified my wife, had them swim like 30ft, at 20 depth, in water where they could actually see their destination saying, "now, use your compass don't look ahead of you at the destination to get there"... We'll see when I get stupid enough to finally try my phone.

 

[JIsgren]

This guy is putting together a way to use your iPhone as a dive computer. Maybe he can help with your quest for an audio compass.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6234655

In fact wouldn't it be cool if you could get the iPhone to read audibly all of the info on the computer. That way you could hear current depth, NDL, dive time, temp, compass. Another possibility would be to have an audio tone that changes pitch based on ascent/descent rate like they use in sail planes.

 

[mtabor]

Hi again Zach,

You will have to forget about PADI I think. Most if not all instructors will not cert you based on the fact you can not meet certain requirements of the course. You will have to talk to either, The Handicapped Scuba Association, Disabled Divers International, or The International Association of Handicapped Divers. They all have programs to help you achieve your goals and dreams.

I know what you mean by hearing you can not do something and wanting to do it even more. My wife is paraplagic in a wheelchair and she has cert from the HSA and PADI AOW so it can be done. She rarely takes no for an answer hah.

I would call or email the local IAHD branch near you to discuss this. Here is the toll free number for IAHD Americas 866-685-4243 and the email address is info@iahd-americas.org

Good luck and post back soon!

Mark

 

[MindeeO]

Mark, I just posted a thread soliciting comparisons of PADI and HSA. I'd be very interested in your, and also your wife's, opinion on the topic. (Sorry for the tangent in this thread!).

 

[flots am]

Seriously though, I've not yet decided to spend the money/risk ruining my phone, due to a faulty "water proof" case, but my final attempt will be purchasing a water proof iPhone case. Since the compass feature on the phone does not actually require data/cell service, I'm thinking there is a chance that one feature could work under water. If I purchase one of the waterproof cases, with water proof headphones, and use voice over (the iPhone's screen reading software), there is a chance I could perform the idiotic straight line navigational swim, my wife was required to do to pass her test.

You might do better with a cheaper phone in a waterproof box, with no holes for anything. Holes will eventually leak.

Also, I'm sure there are electronics guy that would love to work on an interesting project like that, and could probably build one with something much less expensive than a phone.

flots.