Open water and beyond...

[Osric]

I predict that someday you will look back at your todays' self and laugh.

May he be so lucky.

Osric

 

[TSandM]

Honestly, I don't think most of the operators care. We had a couple of students do our OW class and go down to MX, and they were in the cenotes within a couple of dives.

I wouldn't recommend it. No matter how comfortable you think you are, and no matter how good your buoyancy control is for a brand new diver, what you haven't had at this point is ANY experience with anything going wrong. You don't know how you will react if your reg begins to breathe really wet, or your BC leaks. The cenotes are unforgiving of people who can't remain calm in the face of problems.

I love the caves. I fell in love with them the first time I watched a video; I spend a lot of time facilitating people getting cenote tours and getting training. But I do not think the caverns are any place for someone on his first dive trip. Stick to the Coz reefs -- there is a TON to see there, and it is much safer. Do the caverns next time.

 

[ggunn]

HA! I believe this comes from my past experience as an Airborne Infantryman, we tend to be a bit cocky at times. With that said and in my extremely limited experience, I have always felt in control while diving. While I understand that SCUBA is not something that can be conquered in a weekend, or even in a lifetime for most, I believe that my ability to preform basic underwater skills such as bouncy control, the regulation of my breathing, and knowledge of my own personal gear allows me to preform at a level that meets or exceeds the standards set by most diving organizations. I'm always open to improving myself and my abilities and right now I feel that I'm in a position to do just that with my upcoming vacation.

As an Airborne infantryman, would you recommend that a raw recruit after a few days training be tossed out of an airplane into a combat situation? It is one thing to feel "in control" while diving in controlled, safe conditions when nothing goes awry, but it is quite another to react quickly and correctly when things go pear shaped. When diving in general, but especially in an overhead environment, if something goes wrong you only have a couple of minutes to get back in the green and you have to do the right thing right now or you are dead. As others have said, taking an AOW course with virtually no experience diving in no way makes you an advanced diver. Experience is the only thing that can do that.

All that said, if you go cenote diving at this point in your diving career, you will probably be OK. Is "probably" good enough for you?

 

[mjatkins]

I'm just curious, because I have never heard a statistic. Can anyone tell me how many people per year die inside cenotes in Mexico? I'm not talking about people who go off into the cave system, just people on guided tours inside the cenotes. I'm curious how it compares to the amount of people who die doing ocean dives.

 

[DandyDon]

I'm just curious, because I have never heard a statistic. Can anyone tell me how many people per year die inside cenotes in Mexico? I'm not talking about people who go off into the cave system, just people on guided tours inside the cenotes. I'm curious how it compares to the amount of people who die doing ocean dives.

I think the cenotes have a safer record overall, with their 4 divers max per guide - usually shallow dives, no current. Brad does not expect to have 20 dives logged by the time he gets there tho. I don't think he has mentioned any night dive experiences...?

 

[James R]

As a former paratrooper, my default thought is that I can do or conquer anything. The reality that you and I both know is different. When the you know what hits the fan, people very rarely rise to the occasion. You rise to the level of your training. Keep that in mind.

I have had a couple people with barely a handful of dives really surprise me with their skill level, buoyancy, and so on. These people are definitely the exception, though. I can totally see where you are coming from...just keep the A-type personality & ego in check.

A cenote is, in my opinion, a relatively safe dive provided you have a good guide and a good dive buddy. The guide keeps you on the lines, going slow enough to both let you enjoy it and keep up with him without expending a lot of effort while your dive buddy can provide immediate assistance if needed. For what it's worth I enjoyed the two cenotes dives we did last year during the Scubaboard invasion, but I would probably not do them again. I would rather stay on the island and dive the reefs & walls.

 

[halocline]

May he be so lucky.

Osric

Oh come on. Scuba diving is hardly a death-defying high risk activity, every day thousands and thousands of new and novice divers somehow emerge from the water with their lives intact.

To the OP, it is pretty humorous to hear "4 dives....extremely confident". Confidence is nice, but experience is what counts. IMO, the cenotes are not the best place for any new diver, but if you do go, try to arrange a private tour with a well-qualified guide. Natalie at diablo divers is one, there are others. Make sure the guide knows about your experience level, if they agree, off you go. There are nice cenotes where there are recreational divers taking tours all day every day, so they're already fairly knackered up from divers banging into stuff, and the routes are well established and non-intimidating. The diving itself is 'easy' in the sense that there's no current, little depth, and great visibility. But, if you get spooked unexpectedly, maybe your mask starts to leak badly, you have a free-flow, anything unexpected, and you could get in real trouble very quickly.

One other challenge is the fact that buoyancy control is more demanding at very shallow depths, which is exactly what you'll be in, plus there are very strict rules about air consumption. So if you're like most new divers, and you don't have excellent buoyancy control and you go through a lot of air, you can expect a short bouncy dive. Still a lot of fun.

---------- Post added February 15th, 2013 at 11:24 AM ----------

I'm just curious, because I have never heard a statistic. Can anyone tell me how many people per year die inside cenotes in Mexico? I'm not talking about people who go off into the cave system, just people on guided tours inside the cenotes. I'm curious how it compares to the amount of people who die doing ocean dives.

I suspect that the relative incidence of death is statistically insignificant, because both activities have a very very small death rate. Both the island and the mainland have well-established dive industries with strong safety practices and the record to prove it. However, I also know absolutely that in general, overhead environments are far riskier than OW. So, a brand new diver in overhead....in general probably not a good idea regardless of the safety procedures in place. There are always exceptions.

 

[cvchief]

I'm just curious, because I have never heard a statistic. Can anyone tell me how many people per year die inside cenotes in Mexico? I'm not talking about people who go off into the cave system, just people on guided tours inside the cenotes. I'm curious how it compares to the amount of people who die doing ocean dives.

Wouldn't you agree that number of dives is only a guess at competency? I have dove with newbies who had there %^$% wired tight and seemed really competent and with divers who had way more dives than me and seem really lucky to have lived so long.

I would think a paratrooper might have an edge on not panicking, which seems, in my experience, where things really get dangerous, ie the panic and bolt crowd?

 

[Ron Lee]

Brad, regardless of your current confidence level, experience is critical. AOW is a start but becoming proficient at new diving conditions matters more.

I also suggest looking into Rescue Diver. If you become experienced enough to be good at helping others and thus yourself (and your buddy), it is a good thing.

I ponder if an element of the two semi-recent fatalities involved the separated diver panicking due to the separation. If that is a factor, do your research to see if becoming competent and comfortable diving or safely ending a dive while solo benefits your diving needs. I am not advocating solo diving rather doing what is needed to avoid panic if you and your buddy/group become separated.

 

[Osric]

Oh come on. Scuba diving is hardly a death-defying high risk activity, every day thousands and thousands of new and novice divers somehow emerge from the water with their lives intact.

I didn't say the OP was going to die; I said that it'd be nice if he was lucky enough to someday look back on his current self and laugh about it. Focusing on an AOW cert and cave diving with so little dive experience suggests to me that he'll have plenty of opportunity to get into trouble and regret it, and if that happens it likely won't be a laughing matter. These are his risks to take, and I honestly hope he gets away with taking them.

As for advice to the OP, if you want a useful response from me, it'd be "don't do it". If you ignore that, then at least book yourself a private guide who is your buddy and sticks by you for the entire dive. It is my belief that dive fatalities are primarily the result of poor buddy skills and having an experienced diver with you is probably your best insurance against accidents. Some of the statistics here http://www.iucrr.org/fatalities.pdf are of interest, as well as stats starting on page 77 of http://www.si.edu/dive/pdfs/DAN_Diving_Fatalities_Proceedings.pdf.

Osric