PADI swim test

[Walter]

I think we agree about weeding out panic-prone individuals, maybe it's just that we have different methods of doing so.

I think I understand what you mean, but I disagree with the way you've said it. Everyone is subject to panic in the right (wrong) situation. I also don't like the concept of weeding out anyone who is heathy enough to dive. A non-swimmer or a very poor swimmer shouldn't be diving, in my opinion, because they are much more likely to panic. I don't think we should weed them out, we should send them to a swimming class to help them learn to swim before we starttheir SCUBA training.

 

[DCBC]

The needed requirements should reflect the certification and the conditions that the diver will face. If a diver is taking a course in vacation land so he can then hold a DM's hand and be let around in 10 feet of water, that's one thing. If you remove the warm water and the DM out of the equation, then put that same diver into the North Atlantic (33.3 degrees this morning) add current, some waves (currently 8.9 feet) and a diver's minimum in-water ability requirements change quickly.

Obviously certain courses are designed for the tourist industry. Others are designed for less than ideal conditions.

For those who simply think that you're wearing a wet suit and can float. See you; you're on the way to Ireland.

 

[Diver0001]

A non-swimmer or a very poor swimmer shouldn't be diving, in my opinion, because they are much more likely to panic.

If you mean to say we shouldn't be training people who are *uncomfortable* in/around water and that people who are uncomfortable around water are going to be uncomfortable divers I would tend to agree. I would also tend to agree that learning to swim can be a good foundation for building comfort.

But you're adding a step, which is to assume if someone can't swim (very well) that they're automatically uncomfortable around water. This might correlate--how closely I don't know--but it might also just be the case the the person in question never had the opportunity or never took the time to learn to swim (better).

If you read what you posted literally then it says "non swimmers are more prone to panic than swimmers". I don't think this is what you meant to say, is it?

R..

 

[Walter]

I would also tend to agree that learning to swim can be a good foundation for building comfort.

A good foundation is always necessary. Buildings built on poor foundations fall down. Divers without foundation skills, such as swimming, panic.

If you read what you posted literally then it says "non swimmers are more prone to panic than swimmers". I don't think this is what you meant to say, is it?

Close. What I meant to say is, "non swimmers are more prone to panic than swimmers when diving."

I believe swimming ability is essential for reducing the risk of panic in divers. Comfort in the water disappears quite quickly when things go wrong on a dive and the diver believes he is going to drown. Swimming ability greatly decreases the chance the diver will believe he is about to drown. In my opinion, comfort in the water is not enough. Comfort in the water, based on being able to swim, is required.

There are other skills I place in the same category, all of them are essential, but this thread is about swimming...

 

[redacted]

A good foundation is always necessary. Buildings built on poor foundations fall down. Divers without foundation skills, such as swimming, panic.

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I agree that OW students who demonstrate strong swimming skills are almost surely comfortable on the water's surface. From that standpoint, a "swimming test" is probably a very effect first cut. I'm not sure how much different the distance makes (ie 200 vs 300) as I believe the key is looking for comfort rather than speed or distance.

But I also believe that a potential diver who is comfortable in the water can easily be taught to pass such a test. As long as they can stay on the surface and breath, the rest is mostly easily learned technique. Therefore, even just treading water is probably just as good an indicator of comfort as swimming.

 

[Crush]

But I also believe that a potential diver who is comfortable in the water can easily be taught to pass such a test. As long as they can stay on the surface and breath, the rest is mostly easily learned technique. Therefore, even just treading water is probably just as good an indicator of comfort as swimming.

FWIW, I agree. The OP indicated that his son was able to pass a swimming requirement, but only after twice-weekly visits to the pool. My first attempt to swim was a painful flounder where I was lucky to make it 25 yards and not drown. However, with practice, practice, and more practice (and advice from the lifeguard) I managed to finish my 350 yard swim first in my class (just over nine minutes, I believe, while the limit was ten minutes). It must be noted that my class took months, one evening a week. If I had done a weekend crash-course, sufficient improvements in my swimming would not have been possible.

 

[DCBC]

...even just treading water is probably just as good an indicator of comfort as swimming.

I would have to disagree with this statement. Treading water or drownproofing does noting to indicate how efficiently the student can move through the water. In-water "ability" has its place in diving. It's not simply a matter of comfort in a comfortable situation. What about an uncomfortable situation or even a dangerous one?

I have my students swim 400 meters (front), 200 meters (back), drownproof for 15 mins, tread-water 2/2/2 mins (hands only, feet only, both hands and feet), do an underwater swim of 25 meters and pick-up a 10 pd weight belt from the deep end. Regardless of how you feel about this requirement. Who would you feel is most comfortable with diving in current and high waves in the North Atlantic? A student who meets this requirement, or a non-swimmer who has learned to drownproof and swim 400 meters with FMS? It comes down to where the diving is being done, but more ability is always better than a lack of it.

 

[BettyRubble]

Based on my experience as a newbie diver, I was shocked at how rusty my swim skills had become (I grew up a swimmer - 50+ laps a day - 4 different strokes). So I figured, scuba is going to be no big deal.

Then I encountered my first surface swim after coming up off the boat.

Turns out, stamina and conditioning are a big deal. I did it, but I realized quickly that if I find myself in any situation requring either a long wait on the water or a swim to shore, I would be in trouble. So I kicked things up.

I could not imagine being a non-swimmer and facing that. If the non-swim is the vacation diver and doesn't do more then a handful of dives a year. Then the risk is lower. But then again, I sure hope I don't get buddied up with someone like that - especially on a drift dive or something similar.

Rot's comment on panicing is important too. I would imagine a non-swimmer is going to panic more quickly too.

 

[Lead_carrier]

Indeed. now *that* would be relevant to scuba diving...

R..

How so, I know people that are morbidly obese that floats like corks. They can't swim tho. You're shooting your own argument down.

 

[Atomic_Diver]

When I did my swim test for the Open Water Course we did for 3 days each morning before class/pool sessions 60 laps back and fourth in a small pool with Masks, and Fins, and I think Snorkel too (I can't remember..)