Regarding PADI Open Water Certification

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Mr. Ed

Contributor
Messages
107
Reaction score
48
Location
13045
# of dives
None - Not Certified
My instructor indicated he plans to give me scuba diver certification based on left foot weakness and according to him inhibited left side thrust and underwater maneuverability. To compensate I purchased webbed gloves for added thrust. My near final training session is next Thursday, and prove with added glove support I can meet his standards for underwater navigation. I do not believe he should penalize me based on the fact I bend my knees as I kick rather than kicking directly from my hips. I broke my left foot during childhood in which I favor to some degree kicking.

The other possible exercise I had difficulty with was removing and clearing mask underwater, to compensate I bought an Aqualung Pacifica purge mask that works fine. All other exercises I completed without any trouble. If my instructor decides to certify me as scuba diver I will request in detail the basis of decision and if given the opportunity I will redo each exercise to disprove his decision. If that does't work I will request aide and support from PADI Authority
 
...The other possible exercise I had difficulty with was removing and clearing mask underwater, to compensate I bought an Aqualung Pacifica purge mask that works fine.
I'm not an instructor, but the ability to replace and clear a mask is a very real need. It's quite common for a mask to get knocked askew or even off during an entry or dive. A purge mask is not a substitute for the skill, the instructor can't certify you as "OW when wearing a purge mask."

As far as the kicking issue, the instructor can't require specific kicking techniques for OW. But he does need to see that you meet the relevant standards. Ask which standards are the problem and exactly what you need to do to pass them. This will give you something to work on and, if you feel there is an issue at the end of the course, give you a workable basis for your appeal.
 
the ability to replace and clear a mask is a very real need. It's quite common for a mask to get knocked askew or even off during an entry or dive. A purge mask is not a substitute for the skill, the instructor can't certify you as "OW when wearing a purge mask."
Exactly. The issue is not how to get water out of your mask; the issue is how to deal with a mask that is not even on your face. Yes, getting the water out is one of the things that must be done, but not panicking and continuing to breathe and dealing with the mask being off, then on, then clearing it, THAT is the issue.
If the OP can't do that, no instructor will provide an OW certification within standards. And the training agencies will back that up.
There are several program for students who have disabilities that prevent meeting one or more of the standards; as far as I know, none of these work-arounds results in an OW card, but rather one that requires underwater assistance for the safety of the diver.
 
My instructor indicated he plans to give me scuba diver certification based on left foot weakness and according to him inhibited left side thrust and underwater maneuverability.

"Scuba Diver" certification does not really get you anywhere. It's something instructors try to pawn off on their students who don't understand what they're getting (i.e. a "scuba diver" cert sounds like something decent; you have to read the fine print.) It seems like your instructor is just trying to avoid dealing with you, which is unfortunate... but it's just the way some people are. A proper instructor would help you figure out a way to meet the standards of the course within your limitations.

As far as the kicking issue, the instructor can't require specific kicking techniques for OW. But he does need to see that you meet the relevant standards. Ask which standards are the problem and exactly what you need to do to pass them. This will give you something to work on and, if you feel there is an issue at the end of the course, give you a workable basis for your appeal.

OP, this ^^^^^ Those two sentences are everything you need. Either your instructor will explain the relevant standards and what you need to do, or he'll make excuses. If he makes excuses, cut your losses and find an instructor that will work with you. A scuba instructor should stoke your interest in diving; if you don't get that feeling with this instructor, you need a new instructor.

If that does't work I will request aide and support from PADI Authority

Just so you're prepared, PADI is not generally interested in instructors that refuse to certify students. The agency will assume that the student did not meet standards, as assessed by the instructor, and the agency generally puts their trust in the instructor's judgement in these situations.

PADI is much more interested in the opposite situation: where instructors certify a student that did not meet standards, or in a situation where an instructor violates a standard imposed by the agency. I mention this only because if you complain to PADI "my instructor refused to certify me because he said I didn't meet standards", you might be told "yes... that's exactly what the instructor is supposed to do."
 
Did you see a doctor in the meanwhile for losing your consciousness underwater?
 
Did you see a doctor in the meanwhile for losing your consciousness underwater?
For reference: 4ft underwater, dived deeper, momentarily lost consciousness

Mr. Ed,
Scuba diving safely requires a base level of physical skills and health. Instructors and dive physicians can't and shouldn't make exceptions.

If you want it bad enough, you can work up to that level, barring certain physical conditions. It might take a little while, but nearly everyone can get there with some effort.

What you should not do is ignore health issues nor try to work around the necessary physical skills. You might somehow end up with an OW card, but you will be an ongoing danger to yourself and the other divers in your group whenever you are in the water.
 
The other possible exercise I had difficulty with was removing and clearing mask underwater, to compensate I bought an Aqualung Pacifica purge mask that works fine.

Maybe work at your weak points instead of compensating the lack of skills with weird gear?
Why would an instructor give you a C-card if his judgement says you aren’t ready and might be a danger for you and your buddy’s?
 
My instructor indicated he plans to give me scuba diver certification based on left foot weakness and according to him inhibited left side thrust and underwater maneuverability. To compensate I purchased webbed gloves for added thrust. My near final training session is next Thursday, and prove with added glove support I can meet his standards for underwater navigation. I do not believe he should penalize me based on the fact I bend my knees as I kick rather than kicking directly from my hips.
I have read this repeatedly, and I am afraid I need more information, because I don't understand it.

You seem to be saying two very different things here, but as if they are in fact one thing. You say your left foot weakness inhibited thrust and underwater maneuverability. It might do that, but there is no requirement for that. Then you talk about that being the reason you are not passing the navigation standard, which is indeed a requirement. That requirement will require you to swim in something like a straight line, but not at any particular speed.

Are you actually saying that you are having trouble following a compass heading, and the instructor is telling you that your left foot weakness is making that more difficult for you? If so, then that is a problem that can be overcome with a little practice. It actually happens with some frequency. I have seen students who are not using the compass correctly swim a tight circle instead of a straight line because of their uneven kicking.
 
My instructor indicated he plans to give me scuba diver certification based on left foot weakness and according to him inhibited left side thrust and underwater maneuverability. To compensate I purchased webbed gloves for added thrust. My near final training session is next Thursday, and prove with added glove support I can meet his standards for underwater navigation. I do not believe he should penalize me based on the fact I bend my knees as I kick rather than kicking directly from my hips. I broke my left foot during childhood in which I favor to some degree kicking.

The other possible exercise I had difficulty with was removing and clearing mask underwater, to compensate I bought an Aqualung Pacifica purge mask that works fine. All other exercises I completed without any trouble. If my instructor decides to certify me as scuba diver I will request in detail the basis of decision and if given the opportunity I will redo each exercise to disprove his decision. If that does't work I will request aide and support from PADI Authority
Mr Ed. In the 25 years I’ve been teaching diving the skill that poses the biggest challenge is normally mask clearing. I’m looking for my students to be able to continue to breath without the mask, not panic and go to the surface, refit and clear the water - the clearance method isn’t a tablet of stone.

As for having a mobility issue, there are certified divers with missing limbs, even instructors.
 

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