Reports of Monterey fatality

[Bob DBF]

Or quite likely a medical event that may or may not have been hastened by the sea conditions. If that is the case then there shouldn't even be a wrongful death suit. Just a tragedy.

Although I agree with you, unfortunately it does not preclude a suit.

 

[saxman242]

It is a very good LDS.

This LDS is not a mom and pop shop.

Agreed. Same shop that I did my OW with back in the day. Definitely a solid LDS.

 

[wgw04024]

Or quite likely a medical event that may or may not have been hastened by the sea conditions. If that is the case then there shouldn't even be a wrongful death suit. Just a tragedy.

True, I was on a dive where something like this happened, and you're right, nothing to do with the dive op. Two slight differences, the conditions were not unusually bad, and we weren't on check out dives.

 

[Rob Wilks]

Regardless of weather a lawsuit is warranted or not, if these accounts of him being a student are true, why was he in the water? Why was any student in the water? It’s said he was in a refresher course. If so, when was his last dive, and how bout a physical? No way to know if he would have had MI in calm seas or not, but why push that probability? Where did the judgement of the instructor play in this factor? It looked to me this past Saturday many dive outfits underestimated what they were looking at when they were suiting up. Proper situational awareness goes a long way in caring for others.
Many blessings to all who have suffered in this matter. Not easy times for you, I know.

 

[Hiszpan]

Full moon, tidal range bigger, a lot more water to slosh around ...

 

[Hatul]

It was surprising to me that there were so many people in the water. Things looked reasonably calm once you got past the surf, but just a couple hours after the fatality we saw several open water classes going in. They were each at a 4:1 ratio, which suddenly doesn't seem so great when you're talking about people who have never done a surf entry before.

The gentleman who died was quite large, I'm sure that is a risk factor when you add in all the gear plus the extra weight needed for neutral buoyancy. It's not always possible but my personal goal is to train more vigorously than the actual event, so that when things go sideways there's a bit of margin. PADI makes it seem like moderate fitness is fine for most types of diving, and I just don't think that's true.

Actually PADI's recommendation for minimum fitness for diving is 13 METS on the treadmill, which is considerable that many divers cannot meet.

 

[wnissen]

Actually PADI's recommendation for minimum fitness for diving is 13 METS on the treadmill, which is considerable that many divers cannot meet.

That is really interesting, I have never heard of any fitness recommendation. I don't think it's on the medical form. I'm aware of the divemaster fitness requirements but those are all in the pool. Never took the METS test, but I might for "fun". I can run at 4.9 mph for a flat 5K (so 38 minutes) but 15% is a really steep hill. Do you happen to have a source for the recommendation?

 

[raftingtigger]

It is in the section for the examiner to read and is only when there is a question of cardiac fitness.

 

[wnissen]

It is in the section for the examiner to read and is only when there is a question of cardiac fitness.

Interesting! I see now that in fact it's in the PADI medical statement, but under the "instructions to the physician" section, past the part on neurological disorders, under "cardiovascular systems". Not exactly where your average Jane would find it.

When I say that "PADI makes it seem", I'm referring to the less quantitative statements in the training materials. I swear they use the words "moderately fit" or something like that, and emphasize the degree to which adaptive SCUBA allows even those with significant physical challenges to dive.

One instructor I was talking with today also claimed that PADI has a limit of calf-high waves for open water students, which I would be curious to find out if it is true. Certainly around here that's going to be pretty tough to meet in the winter, even at Breakwater. I've been there when it is more like "Lake Monterey" but that's definitely not the norm.

I realize I also didn't give a mea culpa. I heard the call for O2, completed my PADI Rescue less than six months ago, and didn't do anything. There were two reasons: one, I was in the middle of setting up my kit. Two, I could tell from the huge number of divers around (I counted over 75 in the immediate vicinity) and specifically the number of classes, that there were almost certainly at least a dozen divemasters and instructors with much better training and that it was likely I would just get in the way. But I should have checked anyway. Hopefully the next time I'm aware of an event in progress I'll do better.

 

[JohnN]

It is in the section for the examiner to read and is only when there is a question of cardiac fitness.

Holy sweat glands, Batman.

13 METS is a very high hurdle:

• 16-19 MPH on a bicycle (no drafting you wimp)-- 12 METS
• 8 min/mile running -- 12.5 METS
• Carrying a 74+ lb load up stairs -- 12 METS
• 1:30/100 yards swimming -- METS

https://community.plu.edu/~chasega/met.html

How useful of PADI to adopts such a reasonable standard. . .