Responsibility of the Intro Instructor

[DandyDon]

Based on your version of the story, and I am sure you are trying to be objective and honest but still - not being there leaves a lot of possibilties for misunderstandings, yeah - sloppy.

For the record, anyone can call DAN for free at the number appropriate for where they are, for free consultation with a diving doctor, anytime. Membership not required.

To me there is only one way to take people on discover dives and thats one on one! I always keep to the left side of the customer so that I control the low pressure inflator and they never go out of my reach! I know that I am allowed to do more at the same time but safety is a big thing and one on one is the only way to do it! Thats what I think anyway!

Sounds like the best approach to me. I was 1 on 1 with my Discover Inst, if indeed he was an Inst. He let me get out of reach once at 100 ft and I thot I was fine, but mostly I was lucky. He did control my ascent

I've been sad to read recently about the death of a DM's grandson on one of these in which the lone Inst was leading a group of 4, at least 3 of which were Discover divers.

3 discover scuba, and 1 other person in gear (I dont know if he was another 'student', or if he was certified.)
1 instructor

 

[DocIndyDiver]

Uncontrolled ascent all the way to surface. Dive done...out of the water. In my opinion. Time to regroup on the boat and analyze what happened. I wouldn't do one deeper than 33ft.

 

[jon m]

Uncontrolled ascent all the way to surface. Dive done...out of the water. In my opinion. Time to regroup on the boat and analyze what happened. I wouldn't do one deeper than 33ft.

perfect!
i would do this on ANY dive, let alone a "discovery" dive.
if my buddy can't control bouyancy, the dive is over.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

This woman would not have been in OW without at least one pool session to verify she actually had a clue about what was going on. I know there are those who do DSD's in OW, I will not do it in this area as the local spots are not conducive to it. IN another location it would still have to be after some good pool instruction regardless of when the did they last one if it was not with me. And if there was any question as to whether they would be ok in OW- it would not get to that. This is just asking for something to happen. Negligence? Maybe. Stupid? DEFINITLEY!

 

[jviehe]

Couple standards breaches here I think. One, no diving at night, which means 1 hour before sunset. Two, the diver should have had a confined water session before an ow dive. IIRC, referalls are only good for a year. Its just common sense that if someone hasnt been in the water for 2 years, they need to be retaught the DSD.

 

[Interceptor121]

It also seems she was pinching and blowing on ascent due to the ear pressure, which I would have stopped; yawning, wiggling the jaw and swallowing are my preferred ascent eq techniques.

This is dreadful. On ascent you don't need to equalize your air spaces with those techniques as the pressure is actually decreasing.

If you equalize blowing on ascent you risk serious ear injures as documented by DAN research. Some 75-80% of pressure related injuries are actually happening on ascent and in several cases because the diver did what you described there.

At the briefing she should have been explained to equalize ONLY on descent and if she felt discomfort during ascent signal the instructor, stop ascent descend few feet and then go up again slower.

The number of uncontrolled ascents are also to blame because clearly if this person was suffering reverse block those certainly would have not helped at all and generated excruciating pain in her ears.

Was this an intro dive outside an agency standards or part of a course or experienced sanctioned by a Scuba Training body?
If was part of a course the instructor should have covered the correct descent and ascent procedures or at least stopped the wrong behavior of the student upon ascent. In addition to that she should have practiced few basic skills in shallow water first. And finally if the dive was done close to sunset (within the hour) it was also another breach.

If it was not part of a course or experience going to 40 feet is definitely NOT a good idea. Intros should be limited to max 6 meters/20 feet so that if you mess around with ascent or descents the consequences are less harming.

Let alone the guy looking for fish and letting the diver sky to the surface which means he had no control at all over the dive and the divers.

In any case there are several issues of negligence and/or incompetence here

 

[K Mejean]

While it sounds like the Instructor was an idiot I am not so sure about negligence. From the description it sounds like there was some previous experience. Yes some skills should have been done and the Instructor should have been paying attention but someone can get away from you very quickly under water. I have had a diver get away from me that was certified while I was working with their child in an open water class. Luckily I was able to retrieve him and we were in shallow water.
The blood in the mask could have been a busted blood vessel in the nose from the pressure. It doesn't take a lot of blood to fill a mask. Now if the diver flew to the surface then the dive should have been ended so there is an issue there. As far as the snorkle dive goes. If the diver agreed and said they were ok then the operator didn't do anything wrong.
I somehow doubt that the diver in question was in that much pain if they weren't even going to go see a Dr.
Don't get me wrong. I don't think the operator was doing his job properly. I just have some serious doubt about proving negligence. We are only hearing one side of the story. I am sure that you are telling the story as it was told to you and being as unbiased as possible but there could be more to the story that could completely change the way we all look at it.
No matter what though a call to DAN should have been made. Even if it were made by you just to verify. Thats why DAN is there. It is a great service for the dive community.

 

[Jeff Toorish]

Couple standards breaches here I think. One, no diving at night, which means 1 hour before sunset. Two, the diver should have had a confined water session before an ow dive. IIRC, referalls are only good for a year. Its just common sense that if someone hasnt been in the water for 2 years, they need to be retaught the DSD.

Yup, I got that too, good catch.

Jeff

 

[vixtor]

(almost) night dive, snorkeling after scuba, flying the next day, unable to control buoyancy, not aborting the dive when she had issues with it.. yes, it would be nice to have somebody else to be resposible for you.. but (maybe I'm to harsh here), she read the OW manual if she reached the diving stage, and she should have known already that these things are all bad ideas. Natural selection is at work all the time, but for now she was lucky. I cannot understand when people don't care enough about their own safety. Do they have multiple lifes, like the cats ;-) , or what?

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

Since there is still discussion here I will update some things.

This diver did a resort intro with me a couple years ago, that included a pool session before a beach dive out to 35 fsw. She then read the first three chapters, completed the first three KR's and did CW 2 & 3 before doing OW dive #2. I did not offer her a Scuba Diver cert because she did not really dive by herself; I held her hand and physically kept her at depth and got her around the dive site. She does not fin strongly and has a head up posture while underwater; the only way she could get away from an instructor is uncontrolled ascent.

The company she had the incident dive with ONLY does DSD's with skills hanging on a line at the back of the boat in 20 fsw, then they dive on the same tank right away. The instructor was guiding out in front. she said she was unable to keep up with him. With her body position the harder she kicks the faster she goes up, and releasing air from the BC is probably not something she was ready to do. As I understand the PADI DSD the Instructor is responsible for the students buoyancy.

The resort doctor she saw before flying only owned the phone diagnosis of viral sinus infection prior to the dive at the in person appointment with a prescription for antibiotics. An ENT on Oahu did not find any evidence of prior infection, verified by an ENT in Manhatan. She never filled the prescription from the resort doc. No rupture but there was expansion trauma.

When she called the dive op to let them know what she was going through the manager got very defensive and said he would call back after talking with the Instructor. It was actually the Instructor who called back with denials and accusations; all this before she even talked about refunds.

All I know at this point is that she says her ears still feel funny but they are getting better. I do not know if she took the issue further with the dive shop. I do know I can not recommend this dive shop for any training dives and since there are shops there that I do trust that means I will never recommend them for any diving at all, partly due the unprofessional post dive treatments.