Scuba Shack's Boat Get Wet Sinks in Key Largo

[DandyDon]

You mean the dork floating at the surface? ;-)

I get chuckles and ridicule, but I couldn't care less.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Why, so it doesn't get lost? A BCD is NOT and should never be used as a life vest. Even the CO2 inflatable kind are not considered life vests (but are work vests) by the Coast Guard. Why? A life vest must be inherently buoyant, and it must float a unconscious victim face out of the water. Many have head rests on the back of the collar for added buoyancy. A BCD is designed to keep you trim while under the water. Any captain who briefs you to grab for a BCD when the boat is sinking is having a pull on your leg.

Not entirely, Frank ... although perhaps in this country.

When I was at CocoView (Roatan) I asked after the initial briefing where the life jackets were stowed. The response I got from the crew doing the briefing was "you have a BCD, don't you?".

There were no life jackets on board.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[DandyDon]

Not entirely, Frank ... although perhaps in this country.

When I was at CocoView (Roatan) I asked after the initial briefing where the life jackets were stowed. The response I got from the crew doing the briefing was "you have a BCD, don't you?".

There were no life jackets on board.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Years ago while I was at FIBR, I booked a CCV tour to Utila. They were going to take us across the channel without vests, and none of us had BCs. I grabbed a couple off of my FIBR boat. I wonder how many boats I've been on without vests.

 

[HIGHwing]

Why, so it doesn't get lost? A BCD is NOT and should never be used as a life vest. Even the CO2 inflatable kind are not considered life vests (but are work vests) by the Coast Guard. Why? A life vest must be inherently buoyant, and it must float a unconscious victim face out of the water. Many have head rests on the back of the collar for added buoyancy. A BCD is designed to keep you trim while under the water. Any captain who briefs you to grab for a BCD when the boat is sinking is having a pull on your leg.

With respect and consideration to your position and that of the Coast Guard, perhaps we should reconsider the position.

A life jacket's design assumes a victim can lapse from consciousness, whereas a BCD does not. However, if we're going to spend a few days waiting on the ocean, the (orange style) life jacket will in fact become permeated with water, requiring the victim to shed the jacket to maintain positive buoyancy.

Accordingly, if I were going to venture off the boat into the well-traveled waters of the Keys, I would tend to agree with you. Abandon the BCD and get out. However, if we were seriously in a situation where we might be floating for awhile (days), I'd strongly consider taking the BCD for buoyancy as it will last as a floatation device for a longer period of time. One could make the argument that the orange color is easier to spot, certainly, but it's hardly the only consideration. At some point the BCD plus a human is going to be a larger footprint for a spotter than a sunken life jacket.

 

[Wookie]

With respect and consideration to your position and that of the Coast Guard, perhaps we should reconsider the position.

A life jacket's design assumes a victim can lapse from consciousness, whereas a BCD does not. However, if we're going to spend a few days waiting on the ocean, the (orange style) life jacket will in fact become permeated with water, requiring the victim to shed the jacket to maintain positive buoyancy.

Accordingly, if I were going to venture off the boat into the well-traveled waters of the Keys, I would tend to agree with you. Abandon the BCD and get out. However, if we were seriously in a situation where we might be floating for awhile (days), I'd strongly consider taking the BCD for buoyancy as it will last as a floatation device for a longer period of time. One could make the argument that the orange color is easier to spot, certainly, but it's hardly the only consideration. At some point the BCD plus a human is going to be a larger footprint for a spotter than a sunken life jacket.

Ahhh, a military man. You are correct, kapok life jackets used by the military will become waterlogged and sink after about 48 hours. Type I and II life jackets are required to be filled with a foam that will not come apart in salt water for a period of 30 days. You will come apart in salt water before the life jacket does. Additionally, the Coast Guard inspectors I've been exposed to all think it's great fun to give a hearty tug on the waist strap to see if they can rip it. Sometimes they can, and it's time to replace it.

From answers.com:
The Coast Guard made a significant change in life vest requirements after the 1953 sinking of the ore carrier Carl D. Bradley, in which 33 persons died. Many crewmen were found floating among their life vests, having slipped out of them after the ship had sunk. Thereafter, the Coast Guard required that life jackets be designed so that unconscious persons could not accidentally slip out of them if immersed in water.


Plastics are now being used in the manufacture of life vests. Some vests are made from closed-cell foam or foamed plastics which are encased in nylon. Closed-cell foam has been around since the 1940s, but it was not until the 1970s that its use in survival wear was introduced. A closed-cell foam insert is made of tiny, individual air-filled pockets within the foam itself. The air-filled pockets are called cells. This foam structure is similar to a sponge, except that in a sponge the individual cells are connected by tunnels which run throughout the material. Closed-cell foam cells are not connected at all. It is the isolated air-filled pockets which provide the flotation. Closed-cell foam can be punctured over and over again with only minimal effect on its buoyancy. Some of the better closed-cell foam structures will not deteriorate even under tremendous compression. The air-filled pockets also provide some thermal insulation protection against hypothermia.

USCG inspected vessels are held to a far higher standard than are military or government owned vessels.

 

[LynnB]

Why, so it doesn't get lost? A BCD is NOT and should never be used as a life vest. Even the CO2 inflatable kind are not considered life vests (but are work vests) by the Coast Guard. Why? A life vest must be inherently buoyant, and it must float a unconscious victim face out of the water. Many have head rests on the back of the collar for added buoyancy. A BCD is designed to keep you trim while under the water. Any captain who briefs you to grab for a BCD when the boat is sinking is having a pull on your leg.

I never said that is what you should grab but if you have no life vest I would rather have that to inflate to keep me afloat. No captain has ever said that so please don't imply that. My only question was as an alternative.
This is the reason I hate to post anything on here because everything has to be criticized.
Look at all the CRAP that has been posted already. This was a trajedy!

 

[Wookie]

I never said that is what you should grab but if you have no life vest I would rather have that to inflate to keep me afloat. No captain has ever said that so please don't imply that. My only question was as an alternative.
This is the reason I hate to post anything on here because everything has to be criticized.
Look at all the CRAP that has been posted already. This was a trajedy!

Easy, Lynn, it was a tragedy. My point was not to impugn your suggestion, but to make the point that approved life jackets need to be distributed throughout the boat so that they can be accessed at any time by any person. There should never be a need to grab a BCD. And, as far as Captains go suggesting you grab one, even my boat briefing contains a reference to a man overboard scenario where a BCD and scuba cylinder are thrown to the person overboard. I make sure everyone knows I'm pulling their leg.

 

[Jax]

Originally Posted by mike_s

OW classes don't typically teach that. not as part of a curriculum


now days it's slap them through the class room, dunk em in the pool, get their 4 dives in and get their ass out the door.



just because they are certified divers doesn't mean they know squat about boat safety

Gosh, this is informative. I had no idea that proper technique for leaping from a sinking dive boat used to be a standard part of dive instruction before it was dumbed down.

Okay, guys, this slow-assed non-responsive board kept me from properly replying with quote earlier . . .

I'm just saying that people who have made it someone of a habit to giant-stride into ocean waters will be a lot more comfortable un-assing a boat than would two Discover Scuba students. :whatever:

 

[altaskier]

Part of the coast guard required briefing has some critical safety information, such has where life jackets are and where the life rafts are. In my experience divers are too busy setting up their dive gear or talking with a friend to listen to this info. Many instructors don't place enough emphases on people listening to this..

I generally shut up and pay attention, even if I've been on the boat before, if for no better reason than to be polite to the boat crew. I've also seen crew stop the briefing and ask the distracted to give them their attention.

 

[altaskier]

I was on a boat that capsized in Lake Michigan last summer. Without going into detail, there were things that were going poorly but the final sequence happened really quickly, like maybe 10-15 seconds. I know my thoughts at those moments were along the lines of "this is not right," "this is REALLY not right," and "what?! we're going over??!!". There was no time at all to even think of donning a life jacket, or grabbing our BCDs (which of course were bungied onto the boat with tanks strapped on and integrated weights loaded), or having a learned discussion of procedures. We were all experienced divers, but none of us had prior experience in having the damn boat flip on us! However, I think we all had the idea that once the boat was flipping we all wanted to get away from it as quickly as possible so we wouldn't get whacked or trapped. After all, we all had the experience of boarding boats after dives in choppy waters where you want to give good respect to any platform and ladder bashing up and down as you approach.

In my case I can say that I paused for a few seconds to digest the info that I was in the water and the boat was upside down. However, after that "HUH?!" moment, everyone swam back to grab on the flipped-over boat and checked that all were accounted for. (We were delighted to see the Coast Guard arrive an hour and a quarter later).

I fear that the two unfortunate victims may have instinctively tried to crawl away from the stern as it swamped and then got trapped under the cockpit windows as the rest of the boat followed the stern down. An understandable but very unfortunate reaction...