Tipping

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In the long term, I hope we see a change in the American tipping system. In the short term, at least make it clear to all whether someone who is providing a customer a service in the US is a tipped employee like a restaurant server. It's clear how the game works for restaurant servers, but not for dive crew. You can be certain that no US restaurant server "works only for tips"--it would simply be illegal. I'll go a step further than Clark and say tipping restaurant servers IS (okay, ALMOST) "mandatory" because their employers are legally allowed to pay "tipped employees" less than what most of us understand is the minimum wage, and if too many people short the server on tips then their employer has to make it up, which they may or may not do properly. Not to get too off topic, but when I get poor service in a restaurant I reluctantly leave the full 20% per the rules of the game and then leave a complaint with management--I think the server still deserves to receive their regular pay at the expected time, just like any of us who make some mistake on the job. But if a deck hand is working "only for tips," what ARE the rules of the game? Is he really more of a volunteer? If so, why should I tip him? Is he covered by labor laws as an employee? What if he's injured on the "job"? If he's a tipped employee like a restaurant server, then I believe I DO need to leave 20%. I think everyone involved--dive op, deck hand, and customer--could be better off if they had a little more certainty as to what's going on. I realize this goes beyond the issue of tipping, but I think it's all related. It's a mess.
 
From Business Insider (emphasis mine)

Danny Meyer's anti-tipping policy is nothing new — 6 states once banned the practice

Tipping waiters has become like clockwork for Americans.

We don't think twice about handing over 10% to 25% of our bill after eating out at a full-service restaurant.

It hasn't always been this way. In fact, tipping was originally frowned upon in the US and considered anti-democratic, the New York Times reports.

We seem to be coming full circle: The initial grumblings over tipping are resurfacing today, provoked in part by Shake Shack founder Danny Meyer's recent decision to eliminate tipping at all 13 of his restaurants.

Meyer's policy change — which will mean higher menu prices and better wages for back-of-house staff — sparked a a slew of editorials and conversations around the practice, many of which point towards its anti-democratic, sexist, and racist underlying.

The custom originated in Europe, and while its history is not entirely clear, it is commonly traced back to 17th century England. The word "tip" is speculated to be an acronym for "To Insure Promptitude," which was printed on bowls in British coffeehouses.

What is today considered a given started as a purely aristocratic practice — a mere "allowance" that the upper class would offer to the socially inferior.

It made its way to America after the Civil War (which ended in 1865), when wealthy Americans started traveling to and from Europe. They brought the custom back home to show off their worldliness, but it was immediately met with disdain.

Americans considered it anti-democratic, as it encouraged classism and further distinguished the wealthy from the masses.

These initial grumblings escalated into movements. In 1904, the Anti-Tipping Society of America was created in Georgia, and its 100,000 members pledged to not tip anyone for a year, the Times reports.

Anti-tipping laws ensued, starting in 1909 when Washington became the first of six states to pass the new law, but failed to make a significant splash. By 1926, every anti-tipping law was repealed.

Since, tipping has evolved into a given.

However, the early 20th century disdain seems to be resurfacing today.

"The American system of tipping is awkward for all parties involved," Meyer, who owns well-known New York City-based restaurants such as Gramercy Tavern, Blue Smoke, and Union Square Cafe, wrote in a newsletter. "Restaurant patrons are expected to have the expertise to motivate and properly remunerate service professionals; servers are expected to please up to 1,000 different employers (for most of us, one boss is enough!); and restaurateurs surrender their use of compensation as an appropriate tool to reward merit and promote excellence."

Meyer is not the only restaurateur to announce a change to tipping policy. Chef Tom Colicchio has ended tipping during lunch service at Craft, his flagship restaurant in New York City.
 
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Besides having managed waiters, I also worked as one for 6 - 7 years. It's not pleasant wondering if you're coming to work for almost nothing some days, or watching as DanielRJones gets seated in your station. :happywave:

SOURCE

I always give 15-20% when in America. I may not like it or agree with it but I am not a savage. The wife and rest of my family do not hold the same views of me with playing along with the game am will tip as they would in the UK.
But then again when the 10 of us eat out. We will only be 1hour and apart from ordering food and having 1 extra drink we do not need much attendance and if the bill comes to $450 is still a $30-40 tip which in my mind is still a good tip.
I would play the game and give $70-90 which for about 15mins work over a hour tops is a good bloody wage and when you are doing this 5or 6 times a week twice a day it starts to feel like a farse
 
I always give 15-20% when in America. I may not like it or agree with it but I am not a savage. The wife and rest of my family do not hold the same views of me with playing along with the game am will tip as they would in the UK.
But then again when the 10 of us eat out. We will only be 1hour and apart from ordering food and having 1 extra drink we do not need much attendance and if the bill comes to $450 is still a $30-40 tip which in my mind is still a good tip.
I would play the game and give $70-90 which for about 15mins work over a hour tops is a good bloody wage and when you are doing this 5or 6 times a week twice a day it starts to feel like a farse
You had said previously that you leave the customary tip, so that's why I was teasing you a little.

However, it's not a "game", it's someone's income.

Most servers are not making "a good bloody wage" considering the work involved. Clearly you've never done the job, so let me help you understand it a little better.

Did you know that usually servers must share the tip with bussers and food runners? That's certainly most common in a place with a per person average of $45 as in your example. Also, in most restaurants the peak business period is fairly short, so what you see them gross in an hour is not their average for the night. They don't just walk in and start making tips, and then just walk out. There is a lot of work before and after serving food that is part of the job. In addition, good stations are usually rotated between servers, so the one who is busy serving you may do little business the next shift.

It's difficult to know exactly what servers earn, but I think this study is close with an average of about $13 per hour. Not exactly great money for a job that is often difficult physically, mentally, and emotionally. If you don't understand the emotional aspect maybe you've never done your best only to be insulted by someone who recognizes your efforts by giving you 2/3 of what is customary or even less.

I think the thing people have to realize is that if we weren't tipping, the difference would have to be made up in higher prices. Waiters/servers are not going to work for less money, and the business owners, who work incredibly hard, and take a huge risk, are not going to make up the difference out of their profits. No one's bottom line would change significantly if we could eliminate tipping, it would just be simpler and more pleasant IMO.
 
You had said previously that you leave the customary tip, so that's why I was teasing you a little.

However, it's not a "game", it's someone's income.

Most servers are not making "a good bloody wage" considering the work involved. Clearly you've never done the job, so let me help you understand it a little better.

Did you know that usually servers must share the tip with bussers and food runners? That's certainly most common in a place with a per person average of $45 as in your example. Also, in most restaurants the peak business period is fairly short, so what you see them gross in an hour is not their average for the night. They don't just walk in and start making tips, and then just walk out. There is a lot of work before and after serving food that is part of the job. In addition, good stations are usually rotated between servers, so the one who is busy serving you may do little business the next shift.

It's difficult to know exactly what servers earn, but I think this study is close with an average of about $13 per hour. Not exactly great money for a job that is often difficult physically, mentally, and emotionally. If you don't understand the emotional aspect maybe you've never done your best only to be insulted by someone who recognizes your efforts by giving you 2/3 of what is customary or even less.

I think the thing people have to realize is that if we weren't tipping, the difference would have to be made up in higher prices. Waiters/servers are not going to work for less money, and the business owners, who work incredibly hard, and take a huge risk, are not going to make up the difference out of their profits. No one's bottom line would change significantly if we could eliminate tipping, it would just be simpler and more pleasant IMO.

No I waited and served my way though uni so know what is involved.
Any tips we made were all put in together and everyone had the same cut. On a 5 hour shift that used to work out at about £10-£15 for the shift on top of my £5.50 a hour minimum wage.

So a total earning of £37.50 for 5 hours work. Which is $50
 
No I waited and served my way though uni so know what is involved.
Any tips we made were all put in together and everyone had the same cut. On a 5 hour shift that used to work out at about £10-£15 for the shift on top of my £5.50 a hour minimum wage.

So a total earning of £37.50 for 5 hours work. Which is $50
If that was a while ago, then you made about the average after inflation. Did you feel over paid?
 
I felt I was being paid the correct wage. I was getting more than my friends who were working as life guards or working in construction or working in shops.
 
I felt I was being paid the correct wage. I was getting more than my friends who were working as life guards or working in construction or working in shops.
So you felt fairly paid, when you made about the same as the people who do similar work here.
I love consensus! :cheers:
 
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