Ultima Dry Glove System question
- Thread starter Basking Ridge Diver
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Deep South Divers
Contributor
Cool.
I got my samples of Showa 720R. At least sizes 10 and 11 are easy to install on Santi Smartgloves rings (using Santi method). I haven't had an opportunity to test them in water yet. Here water is getting very cold right now so a leaky glove would be a catastrophe. I need to test them (mainly sealing to gloverings) in pool first.
I can already assure that the glove feels very good. Definitely much better tactile feel than the Santi glove or other Showas.
I can already assure that the glove feels very good. Definitely much better tactile feel than the Santi glove or other Showas.
Deep South Divers
Contributor
We are really looking forward to your review!
So the Santi method uses the interior of the glove to seal?
So the Santi method uses the interior of the glove to seal?
This is how much I love the Ultima system with 720s. I have three and a half sets of Diving Concepts cuff rings and five sets of the DC glove rings. I've been diving my Waterproof suit with the Ultima system most of the year except for a few dives when I sent it in for a new zipper. This morning I sold my extra DC rings on Ebay. They sold very quickly because they are still an awesome system. I kept the set that is glued to my DC suit and one backup glove set. I'm still hoping to find some extra Ultima glove rings, but I am happy that the DC rings will continue to be used.
This is a good question
Yes, the interior of the glove is pressed towards the more distal groove by an o ring that is mounted on the exterior of the glove. If the glove has a smooth surface inside, this will create a seal.
But I think that actually the main sealing surface is in the proximal groove of the ring. You are supposed to roll and fold the remaining glove sleeve into this groove and secure it in place with another rubber ring. This is slightly complicated, but seems to keep the water our. And in this groove the folded glove actually provide surfaces that can seal without the interior of the glove.
We would probably need to use some indicator dyes to find how far the water really goes. At least no dirt or silt ever finds it's way beyond this proximal groove in my experience.
Deep South Divers
Contributor
Makes sense.
Since I had an intermittent leak on my right glove, even with the 720, I recently replaced all my seals to see if that would do the trick. While doing the repairs I noticed i still had a set of new 282's on the bench. As i have written before, they are a bit thinner than the 720 and have a really nice liner. The water is getting colder here, so I decided to give them another try with the new seals while I could still afford a failure.
The 282 are really comfy, good dexterity, and warm. They worked great until the last 10 minutes of a long dive. Thats always the case isn't, right up to, then blam. Catastrophic suit failure. I could feel a wrist seal open up and the water poured in, oh well.
I did the repairs today and found the right latex seal had opened up in a place the heat tape didn't stick good enough.
I redid the seal and was glad to know it wasn't one of my gloves. Being thinner, I don't think the 282 will hold up as well as the 720, but it is a nice glove. I will give them a few more dives to evaluate better and post up. I have a couple of deeper dives planned for 2 weeks after I get back from dema.
Has anyone had the oval rings retrofitted and glued into an old suit? That would solve my reoccurring seal failure issue.
.
The 282 are really comfy, good dexterity, and warm. They worked great until the last 10 minutes of a long dive. Thats always the case isn't, right up to, then blam. Catastrophic suit failure. I could feel a wrist seal open up and the water poured in, oh well.
I did the repairs today and found the right latex seal had opened up in a place the heat tape didn't stick good enough.
I redid the seal and was glad to know it wasn't one of my gloves. Being thinner, I don't think the 282 will hold up as well as the 720, but it is a nice glove. I will give them a few more dives to evaluate better and post up. I have a couple of deeper dives planned for 2 weeks after I get back from dema.
Has anyone had the oval rings retrofitted and glued into an old suit? That would solve my reoccurring seal failure issue.
.
Deep South Divers
Contributor
Interesting situation you have there.
The SHOWA 282 (and the less furry 281) have always been of interest because they're polyurethane gloves. Polyurethane (AKA "PU") is comparably a new invention in the world of gloves, and has some advantages and disadvantages over nitrile 720s and polyvinyl chloride (PVC) 660 and 620 family of gloves.
Namely, PU is much thinner and lighter than the other fabrics, even though the protection (abrasion, cut, tear, and puncture) is comparable. According to their ratings, the PU are actually MORE abrasion and cut resistant than the 720s, although they are a step down in tear and puncture resistance... So your theory that thinner = less durable is only half correct.
PU is also supposed to be "breathable," which is to say that air and water vapor (sweat) is reputed to pass right through them, even though they're waterproof. SHOWA even does a convincing video on their website to demonstrate this, but having owned PU drysuits in the past, I believe that the "breathability" of PU is dramatically overstated and not at all noticeable or realistic in real-world situations. In fact, I have doubts that it really breathes anything at all, which is a theory supported by the fact that I have never seen a PU "breathable" drysuit bubble or "fizz" - even when under significant pressure. The SHOWA video I think shows sweat being absorbed by the glove's liner... Not passing through the PU as water vapor. But I digress...
My issue with the PU 281s and 282s is that they're short. They're between 20 and 30 millimeters shorter than the 720s and 660/620 family of gloves. If they were the same length I'd be much more inclined to try them.
Could your pulled-off latex seal have been caused by the shortness of the 282s?
Since you're now in need of either fresh seals installed or a new ring system installed, you now have the enviable task of deciding whether you're going to just do fresh latex seals or go ahead and install either a set of KUBI rings or a set of SiTech QCS Ovals (for the Waterproof Ultima Dryglove Ring system) on your suit.
DRIS (Dive Right In Scuba) is the place to send your suit.
The SHOWA 282 (and the less furry 281) have always been of interest because they're polyurethane gloves. Polyurethane (AKA "PU") is comparably a new invention in the world of gloves, and has some advantages and disadvantages over nitrile 720s and polyvinyl chloride (PVC) 660 and 620 family of gloves.
Namely, PU is much thinner and lighter than the other fabrics, even though the protection (abrasion, cut, tear, and puncture) is comparable. According to their ratings, the PU are actually MORE abrasion and cut resistant than the 720s, although they are a step down in tear and puncture resistance... So your theory that thinner = less durable is only half correct.
PU is also supposed to be "breathable," which is to say that air and water vapor (sweat) is reputed to pass right through them, even though they're waterproof. SHOWA even does a convincing video on their website to demonstrate this, but having owned PU drysuits in the past, I believe that the "breathability" of PU is dramatically overstated and not at all noticeable or realistic in real-world situations. In fact, I have doubts that it really breathes anything at all, which is a theory supported by the fact that I have never seen a PU "breathable" drysuit bubble or "fizz" - even when under significant pressure. The SHOWA video I think shows sweat being absorbed by the glove's liner... Not passing through the PU as water vapor. But I digress...
My issue with the PU 281s and 282s is that they're short. They're between 20 and 30 millimeters shorter than the 720s and 660/620 family of gloves. If they were the same length I'd be much more inclined to try them.
Could your pulled-off latex seal have been caused by the shortness of the 282s?
Since you're now in need of either fresh seals installed or a new ring system installed, you now have the enviable task of deciding whether you're going to just do fresh latex seals or go ahead and install either a set of KUBI rings or a set of SiTech QCS Ovals (for the Waterproof Ultima Dryglove Ring system) on your suit.
DRIS (Dive Right In Scuba) is the place to send your suit.
I had a 720 in place when the seal let go. I have repaired the latex seal, I hope, but still considering the sitech ovals. I’m wondering if I can do it myself, my biggest concern is the diameter of the ring and my sleeve, the way I see it the have to be the same in order for me to get a good fit and seal. If the sleeve has to be modified, cut off, I might be more comfortable with DRIS doing it.
Any input would be appreciated.
Any input would be appreciated.
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