What qualifies as a primary light?

[packrat12]

I love my Light & Motion 800 S/F. I use it for wreck diving mainly. I like that I can switch between spot and flood and also have 3 levels of output for each. I normally dial it down during a dive. It is small and well designed. Looking at the We Test Lights site, I also see that it has a very flat light output right to the rated time. I like it so much that I had my daughters boyfriend buy one last year and she is getting one this year.

I also have had the Big Blue 900NP. Really decent backup light and very bright. It flooded on me this year and not due to the user openings. I will happily replace the head and also recommend it as I think it is a very good light for general diving.

But for the money, I think the L&M is a much better light. Great customer service (so I have heard) with a very functional light. My Big Blue was about $150. My L&M goes for $300. For the $300, I get a much cleaner light design with both Spot and Flood functions.

 

[Aotus]

For cave diving, L&S doesn't offer a light with the burn time necessary for my dives, not for a primary light. My requirement is that it lasts the length of my planned dives, plural, meaning I don't have to charge for a couple days if the power is out. Sure, if I have 3-4 days of diving and no power I'll set my UWLD primary to low or medium, but I'm covered.

Backups are a different story, and generally my criteria for them is less demanding. But, given similarly-priced choices, the data from light tests and testimonials like the post before this come into play.

I have three small BigBlue lights for backups. I've been comparing my BigBlue 1100NP and the Light & Motion Gobe lights on www.wetestlights.com, and thinking about whether I have the best lights for the job, for backups. The BB light declines in output with time, but has slightly longer life (10min). The Gobes stay steady but slightly shorter life. Because my backups are mostly for egress, I am less interested in having a great view than just seeing well enough for long enough. Thus, the small BB lights might be the best option for backups. On the other hand, the L&S lights aren't floodable because they are sealed and cannot be opened (charging via an external cable only). This increases their reliability. Cave divers should have at least two backup lights. In this comparison, if I were shopping now, I would be stuck deciding between having two lights that are (SLIGHTLY) more vulnerable to flooding but very long lasting, or two lights that don't last as long and can't have new batteries swapped in but will never flood. I am content enough with my BB backup lights. But if I had it to do again, seeing the data from that website (especially noting only 10min difference in burn time), I'd go for the Gobes.

 

[packrat12]

The problem with Light & Motion (Sola series) as a backup is that the goodman handle is integrated. Makes it a pain to clip off. For the less serious penetration dives, the L&M Tech 600 has runtimes of 180 - 720 minutes. Not bad for a small handheld but you do pay some serious money for that one, approaching a decent can light. I know some cave divers are using it. At one point, Jill Heinerth was either helping out or representing them. For me, I only do wrecks so the 2-3 hr limitation is fine. I also do not go out into the field so power is not a consideration either.

 

[Aotus]

The problem with Light & Motion (Sola series) as a backup is that the goodman handle is integrated. Makes it a pain to clip off. For the less serious penetration dives, the L&M Tech 600 has runtimes of 180 - 720 minutes. Not bad for a small handheld but you do pay some serious money for that one, approaching a decent can light. I know some cave divers are using it. At one point, Jill Heinerth was either helping out or representing them. For me, I only do wrecks so the 2-3 hr limitation is fine. I also do not go out into the field so power is not a consideration either.

I wasn't (and wouldn't) considering their Sola series for backup, but I'm starting to like the look of the Gobe series. Their sola "tech" is dim enough at the level that gets the reasonable burn time that it certainly would not meet my criteria for a primary. a PADI cave diver I met once told me he prefers dim lights, because half the fun is being in a spooky cave. That's fine. For my work I need a lot of light, and for fun dives I still prefer to see more than less. If L&S produced canister lights, I think there would be real trouble for some other light companies, because that's where some of us are willing to spend a little more money. But, I doubt they will because the cordless market seems to be treating them just fine. And besides, video lights like their 8000 and new 9600 is where their high standards are going to be appreciated the most, and in that realm, small size and sustained high light quality is more important than burn time.

I believe Heinerth is an "ambassador" or some other sort of thing that comes with sponsorship of her work in some way. It was actually seeing that she used their lights for filming that led me to take a second look at the company after having written them off a few years ago when I was unimpressed with that tech light you mentioned...so i guess their marketing plan is working!

 

[packrat12]

..I believe Heinerth is an "ambassador" or some other sort of thing that comes with sponsorship of her work in some way. It was actually seeing that she used their lights for filming that led me to take a second look at the company after having written them off a few years ago when I was unimpressed with that tech light you mentioned...so i guess their marketing plan is working!

It was not Heinerth who sold me on the light actually. It was a technical instructor/avid cave diver while we were diving in black water that convinced me. I loved how his light performed compared to my Big Blue. Other fellow divers had them and I liked how they performed in the wrecks as well. Jill is just a great person to talk with about her experiences. I respect her enough that I gave serious consideration to having her do my CCR training and my daughters SCR and Cavern training. For the last, we chose Lauren K.

I never have nor want to do cave diving. For serious penetration, there is no doubt that only a can light will work. You meet that requirement. In the 80's, I did a lot of cavern/light cave diving in cave country - long before they were parks so I do understand the requirements. At this point, the OP is starting his cavern course. Where he will end up has a lot of unknowns. I just know that it would be a long time before the OP will be conducting extensive cave dives like you do. Because of that, a can light is not the only one qualified to be a primary light. For someone looking at a primary light, I believe that the L&M Sola is a very good choice. It has a lot of capability and obviously they are ethical enough to publish accurate technical specs.

..a PADI cave diver I met once told me he prefers dim lights, because half the fun is being in a spooky cave...

Noticed PADI cave diver - Agency dig here? I personally prefer my light dimmed way down. On recreational penetration levels, I will often turn it off complete and just use other divers glows. On technical penetrations, I rarely have it turned up and normally on spot mode.

 

[Aotus]

It was not Heinerth who sold me on the light actually. It was a technical instructor/avid cave diver while we were diving in black water that convinced me.

I was speaking about my own experience only.

For someone looking at a primary light, I believe that the L&M Sola is a very good choice. It has a lot of capability and obviously they are ethical enough to publish accurate technical specs.

It's up to the OP to decide how to invest. I was only offering my own criteria. I think L&M are making great lights, they just don't meet my own criteria for primary.

Noticed PADI cave diver - Agency dig here?

yep It was the same guy who taught me "cavern" the first time, before I realized that the training was a joke and went and paid for for proper training before continuing on with cave. I guess I still have a chip on my shoulder about PADI's version of cavern training, and their lax instructor requirements. Not all are bad, of course, YMMV.

 

[kensuf]

Bump..

I took a lot of the information (from myself and others) in this thread and compiled it into an article. I then sent that on to a couple of light manufacturers for feedback, and took their criticism's to heart and updated the article. While it will be published in the next version of UWS, I've also put it online.

Lights are life support! – Dive Gainesville

 

[tbone1004]

Good article Ken.

Few points to mention and are getting done as I'm reading.

Goodmans. I find the UWLD soft goodman to be very easy swap between hands because it is more similar to a hard goodman than a light sock

Dive Rite's new light is the HP50 not the H50, definitely want to edit that so people see this when they search for it. This is the first handheld light I would actually consider since it throws a similar light output to most of the canisters unlike the LX20 which was basically an expensive glorified backup light, as are the Halcyon equivalents only throwing about as much light as a 10w HID at ~700-800 lumen.

UWLD puts a braided cover on their cords to help prevent the normal abrasion issues that you find with an unshielded cable.

On the battery side, it should be noted that NiMH batteries are about half as energy dense as Li-Po batteries, but costs about the same per watt hour. I.E. for the same "size" pack in terms of power, it will cost the same, but be twice as large physically.

Good article though and definitely needed to be written by someone that isn't a light manufacturer.

Lumens & Lux
This is probably the most important article published about diving lights because some are adamant on talking about lux instead of lumen in order to make their lights sound better when compared to others because they were seriously lacking in the total light output department. Halcyon is particularly vocal about talking about how useless lumen is in describing lights because theirs only put out about 700 which is similar to a 10w HID when it is new and no one would pay their insane prices if they knew how little light they actually put out. Doesn't make them bad lights, just means there are better options out there and as divers and customers of these companies, it is our responsibility to read between the lines and the marketing words that are trying to be misleading. Same with Light Monkey and still using wattage to talk about their LED's, it's because their lights are about 30% less efficient than everyone elses, so by talking about wattage it makes you feel better about the light you're getting

 

[Jack Hammer]

Bump..

I took a lot of the information (from myself and others) in this thread and compiled it into an article. I then sent that on to a couple of light manufacturers for feedback, and took their criticism's to heart and updated the article. While it will be published in the next version of UWS, I've also put it online.

Lights are life support! – Dive Gainesville

Very nice article ,Ken, and spot on solid advice! Have you considered posting it in its own thread?

 

[Derelict]

The problem with Light & Motion (Sola series) as a backup is that the goodman handle is integrated. Makes it a pain to clip off. For the less serious penetration dives, the L&M Tech 600 has runtimes of 180 - 720 minutes. Not bad for a small handheld but you do pay some serious money for that one, approaching a decent can light. I know some cave divers are using it. At one point, Jill Heinerth was either helping out or representing them. For me, I only do wrecks so the 2-3 hr limitation is fine. I also do not go out into the field so power is not a consideration either.

I've been using a TEC 600 for around 6 months now and I love it. It's definitely bright enough to light up the inside of shipwrecks and a dark cave swim throughs (I have not done any serious cave diving yet). The thing about that light is that it says it's 600lm and it actually is, if not even a little bit brighter. Plus it does not fade or falter.

My only issue is as mentioned, the soft goodman handle. Recently I've been doing tec training, and for valve drills the torch is a total PITA. So for a cavern course, I'd recommend hiring a canister torch. I've been trying to buy a hard goodman handle to use on my SOLA 600 but cant for the life of me find one for sale in Australia.