Where do I go to learn the basics of Underwater videography?

[riverserf]

Hi! I'm really interested in learning about shooting vids while diving. I've been looking around the threads on Scubaboard for any of the "basics" of underwater videography but haven't found much. People seem to know a lot here.

I have a JVC MG37 digital (hard drive) camcorder and I'm thinking of getting the Ikelite housing for it so I can try my hand on my next dive trip (march/april of '07). I didn't see anyone on the sticky that said they have/use this setup.

I'm wondering what people think....if I want to make some good videos do I have to invest in a whole new camera specifically for dive videos? I don't really know much about the cameras that are out there or what the differences are.

Any suggestions on a good website that teaches all the basics? Or a book? Video? I'd love to take a class but I live in Korea now and it's just not possible. I want to have some system ready for my spring dive trip. Any and all tips will be greatly appreciated.

Riverserf

 

[JamesD]

I think a lot of it depends on what you REALLY want to do. I've made videos that I'm perfectly happy with with two setups, my first setup was an Ikelite housing with a JVC camcorder (had the camcorder anyway, picked up an Ikelite housing for it). My current setup is using a Sanyo VPC-C5, which unfortunately I've not been able to take on any "big" diving trips (although I'll hopefully get some video in Curacao next year).

If you find the quality of your JVC camcorder fine then I'm sure underwater will be just fine too, will it be pro quality? Well, that really depends on whether it's pro quality topside, also remember IT CAN FLOOD! which with a Hard Drive Camcorder may be more of a concern (given that you aren't swapping out tapes so any work on the hard drive and not copied off will be lost).

For books this one

http://www.bestwebbuys.com/Jim_Church's_Essential_Guide_to_Underwater_Video-ISBN_1881652262.html?isrc=b-search

was pretty good read, but I think a lot of it is just practice, once you have a good idea of the basics of shooting video you just need to practice, practice, practice. My own mantra right now is "get closer" because a lot of my video is too far away.

 

[scubajcf]

I saw these guys at DEMA. I didn't buy the DVD, but it looked pretty good.
http://discoveringvideobasics.com


Best,

jcf



////

 

[riverserf]

JamesD, thanks for the tip on the book! It looks like a good place to start, along with the video Scubajcf linked to. Thanks to both of you!

JamesD, can I ask why you switched from the JVC cam to the Sanyo? Right now, I'm really impressed with the JVC camera above water...very sharp images...it just seems like such a small unit compared to the big contraptions I've seen divers using. I'm obviously a beginner but I wonder about buying a housing for a camera if it's going to turn out too basic. In other words, I want to make sure I've got a system that will give me "room to grow".
lol....seems like I'm worried about the age old question, "does size matter?"

 

[JamesD]

I turned away from my JVC for a couple of reasons, overall the quality of the video was very good, but my camera is/was about 5 years old now, so larger (compared to the modern Mini-DV cameras) which mean't the housing was quite large, and had quite a large lead weight on the bottom, while this would have been fine for local diving, lugging it about was a real pain, I also found that the ikelite housing for my particular JVC wasn't the best, and that it was sometimes tricky to get the controls to work right. My Sanyo, on the other hand, the camera fits in my trouser pocket, even with housing it's fairly small, it also takes 5MP pictures, so is a fairly good dual purpose device (edit: Oh and no lead weight, which when I have to wear almost 30lbs of lead just to dive here in CA, not having another 5-10lbs of lead for a camera makes a BIG difference). It doesn't take the best video in the world, it doesn't take the best pictures in the world, but it does both well enough for my use (and camera with housing was about $800 dollars total both brand new).

Overall I think it really depends again what you want to do in the near-frame, I envision (and I may be way off base) more and more HD cameras and the technology getting better and better the digital realm (so I expect to see more and more cameras recording to solid state media or hard drives as opposed to tape), while I'm all for buying the best equipment, spending anything more than about $1000 on something I don't use that often is more than I care to do.

 

[www.freedomfilm.com]

I think learning good video making skills requires many of the same skills that on land as well as being in the water. It isnt all about the gear and gadgets. Concentrate on developing an eye... Dont worry about what camera you have etc. An experienced camera operator with a 350 dollar handycam will shoot the pants off of a new guy/gal with a 5000 dollar camera in any situation that will be screened on a standard TV.

I dont know how much you know about editing, lighting, and all those things, so the best advice I can give you is this...

Practice Practice Practice.

If you have a hard drive recorder, no tape costs, so shoot like crazy... And then watch it and compare your shots to your fave movie or TV show. Look at amazingly produced shows like The Unit, Smallville, and CSI Miami where they have amazing camera work, design, and lighting and mood. I know, you probably dont have their budget... But it gives you something to look for, and you can watch the latest trends. Music videos too.

As far as learning videography underwater, and practice goes try this suggestion for an example of how easy it is to teach yourself...

For example... Look at people's wedding videos where they just let the shakey handheld camera roll. Then look at the edited version... See the difference editing makes.

Or go out and try to film the same 3 shots... A pan across a busy street, a tilt up a building, and a zoom to a far away object with and without a tripod... This will teach you some simple lessons about cinematography...

1) Hold your shot STILL.
2) Try not to zoom while recording
3) Master buoyancy ... for ecological, safety, and good video reasons.
4) Let your subject enter and leave the frame if possible.
5) High noon gives you maximum light penetration to depth.
6) Learn about what colors dissapear at what depths and how to account for that.
7) White balance your camera...


Fingers sore from typing... need more tips... ask and ye shall recieve. PS we make movies for a living... (but not underwater... yet)

 

[ronrosa]

JamesD, thanks for the tip on the book! It looks like a good place to start, along with the video Scubajcf linked to. Thanks to both of you!

JamesD, can I ask why you switched from the JVC cam to the Sanyo? Right now, I'm really impressed with the JVC camera above water...very sharp images...it just seems like such a small unit compared to the big contraptions I've seen divers using. I'm obviously a beginner but I wonder about buying a housing for a camera if it's going to turn out too basic. In other words, I want to make sure I've got a system that will give me "room to grow".
lol....seems like I'm worried about the age old question, "does size matter?"

You may be happy with your camcorder above water, but underwater can be different. Camcorders that are good in low light and have access to setting manual white balance are big pluses for underwater video.

Whether or not you will out grow you JVC cam depends on what quality of video you are expecting/wanting. Your JVC will not produce underwater video as colorful as the 3 chip camcorders.

What some people consider amatuer others consider professional. I suggest downloading some video and deciding what looks acceptable. You then have a base point to make a decision on your JVC.

 

[drbill]

Some good advice in the previous post by www.freedomfilm.com. WHERE you film will also affect what you need to learn and practice. Filming in the slightly turbid waters of temperate (and shaded) kelp forests can be quite different than filming in "crystal clear" waters of open coral reef ecosystems.

 

[www.freedomfilm.com]

I forgot...


8) When you think you should hit the stop button... Wait 10 seconds. That 10 seconds after say...??? a shark has swum out of the frame.... gives your editor alot of options.
Also start rolling 10 seconds before as well.. It gives you more creative options in editing.

9) Get close, FILL THE FRAME... Dont take "tourist pictures" where the head of your subject at the beach is taking up 5% of the very centre of the pic... The rest is all empty sky... haha.

Just be careful when getting too close to a moray.. I saw a nasty picture of what they can do here on SB somewhere. Here is my pic of one:

http://www.freedomfilm.com/Freedom Home/Photo Gallery_files/IMG_0546.jpg

10) Remember - HOLD STILL....

 

[diversteve]

Another fairly new book - UWDV Made Easy:
http://www.hammerheadpress.com/pages/UWDV_MadeEasy.html

I've read both it and the Church book, this one is better. They spend a lot more time on the predive/postdive stuff, editing, maintenance etc. than Church did. He spent more time on storytelling and scene selection.

Since the MG37 is fairly new, except for the limitations noted at camcorderinfo.com, it should work pretty well housed. One factor might be that manual white balance is buried in the control menu and only activated by the joystick under the lcd screen. You'll get better results if you MWB at depth.

From a quick look at the Ikelite housing page, it doesn't appear that they provide a control to move/press the joystick so you might ask about it - I'm pretty sure they can add one.

If you do get the Ikelite, I wouldn't worry too much about flooding it if you're careful. They're legendary for their reliability. A point to consider is that it's proprietary for your camcorder, so if you did switch later, you'd probably have to sell and replace it also. That's one advantage the Sony MiniDV/HDV camcorders with LANC have, the housings are somewhat more universal - but not always.

Another point to consider with the JVC is that at the Ultrafine setting, you're recording in MPEG2 at 8.5MPS. MiniDV records at 25MPS. So although you may like the quality, it's not the best. Flipside of course is that you get 7hrs. of recording time. But then you have to dump the 30GB drive to disk somewhere, with MiniDV you just change tapes. Of course it's probably a matter of time before someone hacks your camcorder to add a bigger drive.