Why did I get nauseated? Oil and water in my tank.

[DandyDon]

so you're saying the guy working at the shop was right to make no expression of regret, concern , sorrow nor curiosity.

Joking aside, the business owner will generally protect the business, and can always claims plausible deniability if needed - "a term coined by the CIA in the early 1960s to describe the withholding of information from senior officials in order to protect them from repercussions in the event that illegal or unpopular activities by the CIA became public knowledge." Never, ever admit wrong other than thru one's lawyer in final negotiations, if it goes that far. Generally, protect yourself, on both sides.

My eyes roll when divers claim they don't need CO tank testers because they only get air from dependable shops. You get sick or hurt from a tainted fill, their first priority will be self protection.

 

[iain/hsm]

SNIP My eyes roll when divers claim they don't need CO tank testers because they only get air from dependable shops.

Don.

Eyes rolling or not. They are right.

Sadly your suggestion of a CO detector would have been of little use in this situation.

Frankly in this case the OP clearly doesn't need a CO detector it would have simply overlooked the problem and IMHO made things worse.

An electronic CO detector would have made no difference in fact I would go further and say that it would have been hugely detrimental. CO detectors are not the answer.

Both to the OP and all other divers as it would have given a false sense of security.

In this situation and case he and others would have been duped by the zero CO reading displayed and more seriously duped into thinking there was nothing wrong with the cylinder/tank contents.

Further

1. He would have not necessarily made the connection of his headache and being dizzy with contaminated gas, After all if he had used a fancy CO analyser that would have showed all clear.
Further if he or even had the dive shop used one then both would have been duped.

2. He would not therefore have seen the need to contact the dive shop to discuss or indeed have necessarily have contacted the second dive shop for a VIP inspection

3. By now if he had indeed been using this CO detector he would have put his headache and dizziness down to bad food or a sick day, nothing more and we wouldn't be having this post.

By contrast and comparison my suggestion of a simple smell test even without the $60 visual indicator and the problem would have been revealed to all.

All divers should invest in a nose with two nostrils and a tad more free education.

Not a battery driven CO detector even with the lights. For that just buy a torch. Iain Middlebrook

 

[DandyDon]

Don.

Eyes rolling or not. They are right.

Sadly your suggestion of a CO detector would have been of little use in this situation.

Perhaps not. One reason that a CO alert is important is if they let CO in a tank, you have to wonder what else they let thru. I suspect that CO was also present, but too late to test now.

Yes, he should have smelled the oil, but we are talking about a diver who was ill enough that he puked on the first dive, but went back again.

 

[nadwidny]

Perhaps not. One reason that a CO alert is important is if they let CO in a tank, you have to wonder what else they let thru.

Generally it would be CO2 since high levels of CO are usually accompanied by high levels of CO2. I have yet to see a case where it's not.

 

[iain/hsm]

Generally it would be CO2 since high levels of CO are usually accompanied by high levels of CO2. I have yet to see a case where it's not.

I would agree to a point but with one exception detailed below.

Generally when discussing the source of both the CO and C02 in divers air it has to be specified IMHO first as to how it got there.

Generally in reciprocating air compressors and only those that are oil lubricated It is commonly caused by over heating the oil within the compressor and the corresponding oil breakdown it in effect burns resulting in some very nasty chemicals. We could discuss in detail later.

Hence my earlier point that in an oil-free, oil-less compressor this is impossible.

The other means of C0/C02 getting in the compressor is by being entrained into the air intake. The gas finding its way into the air intake of the compressor from either the surrounding atmosphere car exhaust etc, poor positioning down wind low intake position etc and from the combustion engine itself if the compressor is petrol (gas) driven.

The one exception for high C02 but with zero CO, is when positioning the air intake inside a small enclosed room or as is generally done in most scuba compressor companies in that they position the air intake directly on the compressor itself

If this is the case in a small room with four guys talking by analysis you can clearly see the C02 levels rising in the gas analysis.

This however pales into insignificance and you have my full assurance when I say that I would fully expect the level of CO2 in the same room to be substantially greater if by example………..
It were four women chatting rather than men. :shocked2:


I rest my case. LOL Iain Middlebrook

 

[chillyinCanada]

Harumph, says I to the man with the most voluminous word count in this thread.

 

[iain/hsm]

Harumph, says I to the man with the most voluminous word count in this thread.

ROFL Says the man with a 2305 post count to my 220

But joking aside this is a critical subject others reading I trust may learn, we have only scratched the surface
Its a difficult subject to get across in a clear transparent and I trust informative way. Iain Middlebrook

 

[nadwidny]

I would agree to a point but with one exception detailed below.

That's why I said "Generally". Because I knew someone would bring up the over-heated oil thing and I was hoping to avoid that.

 

[DavidRDiver]

Don.



By contrast and comparison my suggestion of a simple smell test even without the $60 visual indicator and the problem would have been revealed to all.

All divers should invest in a nose with two nostrils and a tad more free education.

Iain Middlebrook

I recently had a similar scenario, however did not get sick. Had two cylinders refilled after my mornings dives. One of which was a brand new as in second time it was filled cylinder. We had to wait a significant amount of time for the fills as the shop was busy.

I DID smell my cylinder prior to diving it, and there was no apparent odor. What I did notice was about mid point on the dive I had a funny taste in my mouth. We stopped back at the dive shop and the compressor operator told us they had just changed out the filters that day, and had some new fixtures(whatever the hell new fixtures are) I took my cylinders the one I dove and the one I had not dove yet (the newer of the two) ended up having to VIP and have both cleaned. I wrote a letter to the offending shop and have been patiently waiting for a response. I also own a small business and if a customer actually took the time to write me a letter I would at the very lest respond to it. I'm giving that shop another week before I broadcast their name.

FWIW the second cylinder had no odor to it until I opened the valve and let it drain for a couple of minutes.

 

[CaptainHornblower]

I agree, that normally one would smell the air and notice something was wrong. I had throat cancer 3 years ago and the chemo and radiation treatment left my tasting and smelling ability significantly impaired. So I guess I bear some responsibility there, but is was not a case of inattention or ignoring an obvious smell, I just can't smell or taste very well anymore.

As far as going back in, I waited an hour and a half, was feeling significantly better, and given that I had no reason to suspect that the air was bad and we weren't going far or deep I don't think that was a huge error in judgement.

I understand that thing happen, we all make mistakes. What I found most objectionable was the fact that when I called and asked if they'd had any problems the owner pretended like he had no idea what could possibly have happened, said they'd had no issues and had no idea what could have happened. In fact, he knew a filter had cracked and it took them a week or so to get the parts and the system cleaned up. The other dive shop operators in town all knew about it. So I was left trying to figure out what had gone wrong.

Then when I called back and confirmed to him that he had an issue, he ignored it. How many other divers have tanks with water and oil in them?