Given the increasing popularity of HOG, the fact that a variety of respected divers, and popular online personas started to switch over and are pretty vocal about it, and the existence of a grey market for service kits/parts, I wonder why Aqualung/Apeks has not yet offered a service class and open access to parts for tech divers who would like to work on their own equipment. I am curious, what is the rationale for keeping the current policy, is it believed to somehow benefit either the company or the diving community? What would happen if you followed HOG's example and relaxed the restrictions for tech divers? Would someone get hurt, or would it, in fact, be a change for the better?
Why no regulator service class and free access to service kits/parts for tech divers?
- Thread starter kr2y5
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It would be anarchy.
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I dont agree. I think you would find that to many would start to work on thier own regs with out the proper tools ect. Next is the issue of putting outdated kits in the regs. You know. " I just bought 25 kits for my regs , that will last me at least 10 years." Then the letigous issues of giving parts to bob who is uncertified to service jims regs and jim dies. I think that in todays legal environment it just can't be allowed to happen. Granted most shops do not have qualified techs to service specific regs, but there you go. I would say that the concensus would be dont give matches to a 5 year old. and all non shop people are 4 and younger.
What i do find is cheesy is when a kit retails for 10-15 usd and because of the mentioned inavailability the lds charges/guoges you 50 usd for it on top of the labor. Ive seen regs come out of a shop servicing with a 150 usd tag on it. I may be mistaken but i believe the lds's get many kits free. IE your are a XYZ distributer or shop and the free kits is a beni you get for being one. Besides the franchise issues i am sure that the lds liability carriers have some say in it also.
I think this issue is akin Issues such as:
Why do many charter boats do not allow you to dive solo if you have the card.
Why do lds's hot fill to 3k and then the tank cools to 26-2700 and it is still called a full tank.
Just last week i went to get a tank fill of air in my nitrox tank. Becaue of the green vip sticker saying 40% nitrox on it the guy made me pay 15 for a nitrox fill instead of 8 for the standard air fill for air. So I said fill me with 32 if i have to pay for it anyway.
I think there are things we just have to accept even when conditions are caused by others.
What i do find is cheesy is when a kit retails for 10-15 usd and because of the mentioned inavailability the lds charges/guoges you 50 usd for it on top of the labor. Ive seen regs come out of a shop servicing with a 150 usd tag on it. I may be mistaken but i believe the lds's get many kits free. IE your are a XYZ distributer or shop and the free kits is a beni you get for being one. Besides the franchise issues i am sure that the lds liability carriers have some say in it also.
I think this issue is akin Issues such as:
Why do many charter boats do not allow you to dive solo if you have the card.
Why do lds's hot fill to 3k and then the tank cools to 26-2700 and it is still called a full tank.
Just last week i went to get a tank fill of air in my nitrox tank. Becaue of the green vip sticker saying 40% nitrox on it the guy made me pay 15 for a nitrox fill instead of 8 for the standard air fill for air. So I said fill me with 32 if i have to pay for it anyway.
I think there are things we just have to accept even when conditions are caused by others.
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Eric Sedletzky
Contributor
I don't think by the bigger companies selling parts to DIY'ers would make a hill of beans of difference to shops. There will always be about 99% of the public that will never service their own regs.
We see a lot of talk about it here on SB, but there's also a concentrated population of tech divers and DIY'ers here too.
They sell oil and filters at parts stores but look at how many people still take their car to the 10 min oil change places.
And the last time I checked mechanics shops of all sorts are not suffering.
I think it's just a liability mindset myself.
If the companies openly sell parts then they are probably thinking they are opening themselves up for lawsuits. The dive shops maybe aren't selling parts because of a conflict of interest,... and maybe liability concerns too.
There are parts out there on the black market. Aqualung parts are actually easy to get, easy enough that I can service everything Aqualung that I have.
People are going to continue to obtain parts no matter what. I think it would be in their (companies) best interest to offer service classes regardless if they offer parts or not.
At least the people that want it could get an education so they won't get hurt.
We see a lot of talk about it here on SB, but there's also a concentrated population of tech divers and DIY'ers here too.
They sell oil and filters at parts stores but look at how many people still take their car to the 10 min oil change places.
And the last time I checked mechanics shops of all sorts are not suffering.
I think it's just a liability mindset myself.
If the companies openly sell parts then they are probably thinking they are opening themselves up for lawsuits. The dive shops maybe aren't selling parts because of a conflict of interest,... and maybe liability concerns too.
There are parts out there on the black market. Aqualung parts are actually easy to get, easy enough that I can service everything Aqualung that I have.
People are going to continue to obtain parts no matter what. I think it would be in their (companies) best interest to offer service classes regardless if they offer parts or not.
At least the people that want it could get an education so they won't get hurt.
Eric
I agree with you in regards to the liability issues. Tell me, What does it take to go to a reg class like shops go to or is there a thing with the manufacturers that the student has to be shop sponsered? Or is the completion cert only valid if employed at a LDS.
I agree with you in regards to the liability issues. Tell me, What does it take to go to a reg class like shops go to or is there a thing with the manufacturers that the student has to be shop sponsered? Or is the completion cert only valid if employed at a LDS.
Liability for selling parts is just a smoke screen, LSD profit is the major reason. I have ask those who say it's a liability issue for any case, any where on on any piece of equipment (scuba/auto/airplane/whatever) that involved a customer being sold good (not defective) parts and so far no one has come up with anything. Think about it for a minute and it's clear that if liability were the reason, it would make better sence to sell the parts and not service them at all. Odds of selling defective parts is slim, having some tank monkey that set in a 1/2 day class that is now "certified" to service gear screw up a reg is a much bigger liability. If anything offerning classes would increase the liability, I can see a case based on " I screwed up and hurt someone because you did not instruct me properly, therefore it's your fault", I might even vote for the plaintiff if on the jury but a case based on "you sold me perfectly good parts and I installed them wrong and hurt someone, you are at fault" , I just don't see that happening.
Bottom line, it's a cash cow that the dive industry does not want to let go of.
---------- Post added June 16th, 2014 at 07:00 AM ----------
Liability for selling parts is just a smoke screen, LSD profit is the major reason. I have ask those who say it's a liability issue for any case, any where on on any piece of equipment (scuba/auto/airplane/whatever) that involved a customer being sold good (not defective) parts and so far no one has come up with anything. Think about it for a minute and it's clear that if liability were the reason, it would make better sence to sell the parts and not service them at all. Odds of selling defective parts is slim, having some tank monkey that set in a 1/2 day class that is now "certified" to service gear screw up a reg is a much bigger liability. If anything offerning classes would increase the liability, I can see a case based on " I screwed up and hurt someone because you did not instruct me properly, therefore it's your fault", I might even vote for the plaintiff if on the jury but a case based on "you sold me perfectly good parts and I installed them wrong and hurt someone, you are at fault" , I just don't see that happening.
Bottom line, it's a cash cow that the dive industry does not want to let go of.
---------- Post added June 16th, 2014 at 07:00 AM ----------
Liability for selling parts is just a smoke screen, LSD profit is the major reason. I have ask those who say it's a liability issue for any case, any where on on any piece of equipment (scuba/auto/airplane/whatever) that involved a customer being sold good (not defective) parts and so far no one has come up with anything. Think about it for a minute and it's clear that if liability were the reason, it would make better sence to sell the parts and not service them at all. Odds of selling defective parts is slim, having some tank monkey that set in a 1/2 day class that is now "certified" to service gear screw up a reg is a much bigger liability. If anything offerning classes would increase the liability, I can see a case based on " I screwed up and hurt someone because you did not instruct me properly, therefore it's your fault", I might even vote for the plaintiff if on the jury but a case based on "you sold me perfectly good parts and I installed them wrong and hurt someone, you are at fault" , I just don't see that happening.
chrisch
Contributor
I'm not sure a person's dive quals have any bearing on their ability to service kit. It is, in essence, an engineering task. It only makes sense therefore to either allow anyone to buy parts (like Germany) or no-one.
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