Wife against me getting Cave Cert (full)..suggestions?

[Stoo]

Happy wife, happy life.

I did a bit of cave diving eons ago, but raised the issue of starting again (with updated training) recently. Mrs. Stoo was not AT ALL in favour of it.

I chose to respect her wishes...

 

[Kristi@CCDS]

How against is she? Like no way in hell? Or I'm really worried about x y z? If she's dead set against it...honestly it might be a choose your battle kind of decision, you'll feel guilty if you guilt her into letting you do it, and long term you likely won't end up staying in the sport. This is an expensive hobby to get in to at this level of diving and I've known a handful of people who have dropped out for one reason or another and ended up having to sell gear (at much less than they paid for originally).

If she's just nervous about the idea I'd pitch that she should sit in on the classroom/lecture portion of cavern training. Most people fear what they don't understand. Perhaps if she listens to the lecture she will start to realize that a lot of redundancy and skills are built in to the training to make it as safe as possible. (Honestly I feel much safer cave diving than I do driving down the highway most days.) Also some good reading for you both would be the NSSCDS manual : Basic Cave Diving: A Blueprint for Survival. It's a text that goes over cave diving accident analysis and explains why certain rules were put in place to try to prevent further accidents.

 

[kelemvor]

It is generally argued that, other than fatalities attributed to medical conditions, only one trained diver (Parker Turner) died without violating a safe diving protocol. (He was the victim of a very rare cave-in.) That is not true. I know some others. Those others that I know of were doing dives at the extreme edge of the cave diving spectrum of danger, dives I myself would not dream of doing.

I think there may be a handful of other trained cave divers who have died without violating protocol. Dave Shaw for example. Unless I'm just misinformed about that accident.

 

[bamafan]

If you take out the rebreather divers, untrained divers and medical incidents cave diving is extremely safe. I only know of one trained cave diver who didn't fit into one of the above categories or didn't violate one of the basic rules that died in a cave. That was Parker Turner in a cave collapse. You have to remember that most of the people talking about how dangerous it is generally have something to be gained from making it seem so. And I am sure you will find it hard to believe but that is $$$. I personally feel like it is more dangerous single tank diving in the ocean than cave diving.

 

[Dizzi Lizzi]

I think this is one of those both should agree decisions because the stakes can be very high. Education can help alleviate some fears, or it can intensify some fears. Good luck, and remember how much you love her. She's telling you how much she loves you. Hopefully you both can come to a decision where you agree and feel comfortable.

 

[boulderjohn]

I think there may be a handful of other trained cave divers who have died without violating protocol. Dave Shaw for example. Unless I'm just misinformed about that accident.

The first set of "rules" for safe cave diving that I know of can be found in Sheck Exley's 1979 book, Basic Cave Diving: A Blueprint for Survival. Rule #3 is "Avoid deep diving in caves" (p. 13). In his analysis, he talks about what he calls "depth blackout," something that his research indicated happened to divers on the deepest depths they had ever done and often after heavy exertion. Exley concludes that chapter by saying, "The foolhardy who insist on diving to deeper depths anyway should contact should contact experienced cave divers first for guidance" (p. 14).

Shaw was on his deepest dive when he died--in fact, it was a record depth. He was exerting himself heavily, and he had planned to exert himself by doing a difficult task at that depth.

Of course, Shaw had descended on the line Exley had placed there when he had set the record depth years before, and Exley himself died on a record setting depth attempt. I was recently told by someone who had dived to gerat depths with Exley in the ocean that Exley was himself prone to "depth blackout" and had gone unconscious that way on more than one occasion while they were diving together. He believes that Exley realized it was about to happen on his final dive, and that is the reason he tied himself off to his line before he died--he was hoping to wake up later and finish the dive.

 

[boulderjohn]

What I the OP should tell his wife in regard to the David Shaw episode is that when he gets his cave diving certification, he will not do any body recovery dives deeper than 900 feet while on a rebreather.

 

[kr2y5]

I am not a cave diver, and I do not currently plan on becoming one, although my wife did accept my solo diving despite her initial strong reaction.

The way you frame the problem is important. It is probably just a matter of somewhat unfortunate wording, but if you want to "get wifey to go along", you might be putting yourself in the frame of mind where it is more about persuasion and "tweaking" the other person to comply, than genuinely understanding and addressing each other's needs. Since it is ultimately a matter of trust, and the other person will be able to sense your intentions, whatever they might be, it is important that you approach it from the right perspective from the beginning, and frame this as a problem for you to solve together.

I particularly recommend this book, since it's based more on openness and dialogue, rather than on crude cabbage salesman's tactics like many others.

 

[CuzzA]

@Landlocked123 I setup life insurance policies. Let me know if you need a quote. Problem solved.

No seriously, good advise above. I went through this with spearfishing and sharks. I assured her I'm the big dog in the sea, not the sharks and I increased my life insurance.

 

[CptTightPants21]

@Landlocked123 I setup life insurance policies. Let me know if you need a quote. Problem solved.

No seriously, good advise above. I went through this with spearfishing and sharks. I assured her I'm the big dog in the sea, not the sharks and I increased my life insurance.

All joking aside, the life insurance part is good advice. I just signed a 1.5mm policy--Full Cave is on the horizon.