What's the Largest Size Wing You Would Ever Use?

[LiteHedded]

I'm in favor of limiting tank wrap, but using poorly conceived "rules of thumb" like 8" tanks need 60 lbs wings is not the way to achieve that goal.

Far, far more important is selecting a wing that has no more lift capacity than the application demands.

Weight of the back gas + Buoyancy of the drysuit with minimum gas +~2-3 lbs allows the diver to select a wing with enough lift. Smaller wings will wrap *all* cylinders less.

Tobin

well that drives us all to a DSS wing doesn't it? oh you need exactly 26lbs of lift? where can i get that? DSS.
slide rule indicates you need 38lbs of lift? dang the 40lb halcyon wont work, i must need a DSS

what AJ says here is correct. 40lb'er for al80s and the like, 55-60ish for the big steels and move on with your life

 

[cool_hardware52]

Generally

Have you ever even seen MP 120s? Like in real life? I sure haven't.

Yup, they were not uncommon here in the SoCal area a few years back.

Probably shock you to learn that PST 104's are pretty rare around here too.


Tobin

 

[cool_hardware52]

Generally

Hum, I guessed I missed your qualifier "Generally" in your first post, you know, the one that ended with

"Done and done"..........

Tobin

 

[cool_hardware52]

8" doubles get a 55-60lb wing

7" doubles get a 40-45lb wing

Singles get a 30lb wing.

Done and done.

Help me understand. You have repeatedly claimed that the .6" of addition tank wrap a diver would suffer if they used 7.25" diameter doubles in place of 8" diameter doubles is of great concern and should be avoided.

How then do you reconcile recommending a 30 lbs wing for all single tanks, regardless of diameter or required lift?
Clearly a 30 will wrap more than a 17 or 18 lbs wing....

Tobin

 

[PfcAJ]

Help me understand. You have repeatedly claimed that the .6" of addition tank wrap a diver would suffer if they used 7.25" diameter doubles in place of 8" diameter doubles is of great concern and should be avoided.

How then do you reconcile recommending a 30 lbs wing for all single tanks, regardless of diameter or required lift?
Clearly a 30 will wrap more than a 17 or 18 lbs wing....

Tobin

Its sloppy dude. Try it. Go put on some 7'' tanks with a 60lb wing and feel the difference.

You're sittin behind a computer doing math problems instead of feeling the differences.

It probably will wrap, but its GOTTA FLOAT WITHOUT YOU IN IT.

You sell a 12lb wing Tobin (one of the 11 different ones you sell). You're trying to justify selling 11 different types of wings when in reality 3 is all anyone needs.

Uh oh, today I'm wearing a new 200g undergarment instead of my old 200g undies! Better call Tobin up for another wing!

 

[PfcAJ]

Yup, they were not uncommon here in the SoCal area a few years back.

Probably shock you to learn that PST 104's are pretty rare around here too.


Tobin

lol I guess they all disappeared between then and now?

You're a hoot

 

[cool_hardware52]

Its sloppy dude. Try it. Go put on some 7'' tanks with a 60lb wing and feel the difference.

Sigh..

I have zero need or desire to use 60 lbs wing.

Humm, The largest wing DSS offers is a 57, and we sell only a few a year. Why? Because very few divers are using a combination of exposure suit buoyancy and back *gas* mass to demand more than our 49 lbs wing.

With the largest cylinders in common use, 130's, a diver will have ~ about 20 lbs of air or nitrox, less if they have significant He in the tanks. 49 - 20 leaves 29 lbs (or more with High % helium mixes) for suit buoyancy Very few drysuits on people of normal stature are 29 lbs positive with minimum gas in them, most are in the middle 20's or less. Drysuits that are greater than 30 lbs positive certainly do exist, but they are not common.

If your concern is how "floppy" your wing is a 49 with a 9 inch center panel will wrap *any* tank less than a 60.

Limiting tank wrap by matching the capacity to the application is why DSS offers 4 standard capacities (and a couple "off list" specials) for doubles.

Tobin

 

[PfcAJ]

But does it float the rig without a diver in it?

I can recall dragging my 104s up a creek with a 55lb wing burping at the OPV and it barely being afloat. I can also recall on NUMEROUS occasions trying to move an rb80 with lp120s (the rebreather is neutral, btw) and the thing burping like mad and still being quite heavy.

I seent it, Tobin. With my own eyes.

 

[cool_hardware52]

But does it float the rig without a diver in it?

I can recall dragging my 104s up a creek with a 55lb wing burping at the OPV and it barely being afloat. I can also recall on NUMEROUS occasions trying to move an rb80 with lp120s (the rebreather is neutral, btw) and the thing burping like mad and still being quite heavy.

I seent it, Tobin. With my own eyes.

I'd suggest your "55" wasn't delivering rated capacity. This is actually quite common.

PST 104's are supposed to be about -11 full. Lets be generous and say they were -15 each, nice fat cave fill

2 x 104's full 30 lbs
Dual regs 4
Tank bands and manifold 4
Can light (bad old days) 6
Stainless Plate and harness 6
Total 50 lbs.

Of course one could use a alum plate and save ~4 lbs That leaves 46 lbs. Why a "55" couldn't easily float 46 lbs is really the question.

____________________________

DSS Torus 49

2 x full E-8 130's 10.5 x 2 = 21lbs
Dual regs 4 lbs
Tank bands and Manifold 4 lbs
Can light 2 lbs
Medium Stainless Plate and Harness 6 lbs

Total 37lbs with full tanks and about 17 with empty tanks



I've done *exactly* this numerous times, no issues.

Tobin

 

[Jack Hammer]

Even scientists test their math against real world performance...