How to rig a pony bottle?

[Macan]

There are good reasons to sling your pony on the left side. One of them is to ensure that your long hose is easily deployed. When using your pony reg, the pony hose is looped round your neck.

Computers are wrist/arm mounted (vs console type) and worn on the right arm (vs left arm whether you are right or left handed).This setup has 2 benefits.

First, it allows the diver to very quickly monitor depth, time, NDL/Deco, etc, at the "flick of the wrist". Second, buoyancy control is better managed - left hand controls the BCD inflators/deflator and right arm (with computer on the right wrist) allows the diver to check his depth and other vitals.

While there are other ways to configure your gear, what I just described is the standard technical configuration. It works. Even for recreational diving.

 

[savsuds]

There are good reasons to sling your pony on the left side. One of them is to ensure that your long hose is easily deployed. When using your pony reg, the pony hose is looped round your neck.

Computers are wrist/arm mounted (vs console type) and worn on the right arm (vs left arm whether you are right or left handed).This setup has 2 benefits.

First, it allows the diver to very quickly monitor depth, time, NDL/Deco, etc, at the "flick of the wrist". Second, buoyancy control is better managed - left hand controls the BCD inflators/deflator and right arm (with computer on the right wrist) allows the diver to check his depth and other vitals.

While there are other ways to configure your gear, what I just described is the standard technical configuration. It works. Even for recreational diving.

I am sorry, but I don't rock a long hose when recreational diving. If my AI and/or computer fails I like being able to pull my console up to check my gas/depth. My muscle memory knows where I keep things, so I do not have to look down to find something. When I added a Pony Bottle to my recreational dive setup 18+ months ago, I slung it in such a manner as to not relearn muscle memory. I just learned the addition (Pony bottle) to reduce task loading for myself. So, slinging it on the left does not work for me. I like slinging it across my chest so it acts like a ship's keel when I am diving.

I appreciate your reasoning for slinging left and wearing wrist computers on the "correct" wrist, but they do not correspond with the dive configuration of 80%+ of recreational divers. Most use rental gear with consoles.

EDIT: I think we should not try and change his dive configuration drastically in order to add a Pony. Just tweak it in a manner to be safe.

I agree a BP/W would fit best with a Pony use. The additional attachment points alone is reason enough to change to BP/W.

 

[barth]

I am sorry, but I don't rock a long hose when recreational diving. If my AI and/or computer fails I like being able to pull my console up to check my gas/depth. My muscle memory knows where I keep things, so I do not have to look down to find something. When I added a Pony Bottle to my recreational dive setup 18+ months ago, I slung it in such a manner as to not relearn muscle memory. I just learned the addition (Pony bottle) to reduce task loading for myself. So, slinging it on the left does not work for me. I like slinging it across my chest so it acts like a ship's keel when I am diving.

I appreciate your reasoning for slinging left and wearing wrist computers on the "correct" wrist, but they do not correspond with the dive configuration of 80%+ of recreational divers. Most use rental gear with consoles.

EDIT: I think we should not try and change his dive configuration drastically in order to add a Pony. Just tweak it in a manner to be safe.

I agree a BP/W would fit best with a Pony use. The additional attachment points alone is reason enough to change to BP/W.

Well, you are telling that it doesn't correspond the configuration of 80+% of REC divers.

But you are telling that a bp/w is is best fit a ponybottle. But stage on your right doesn't correspond with 80+% of the bp/w divers.

It would be better to use a pony at the left. He doesn't have that much experience. It would be better to get used to the pony at the left than change things whe he maybe want to use a longhose in the future. Than he had not relearn muscle memory...

I started diving bp/w with 37 dives with single tank. It doesn't matter if I use a scooter, doubles stages. Spg, longhose, inflator, dumpvalve position, Back-up etc are still the same. But when I started I thought I would never buy a scooter and would never do tech or cavediving and would never buy a drysuit etc. It is nice that muscle memory is the same since dive 37...

 

[smellysocks]

Anyone in this thread that is decrying the use of a redundant gas supply as a mistake and or evidence of a lack of skills should seriously revisit their choice of hobby. In what world is adding a measure of safety a sign of a bad diver?


A redundant gas supply is a safety device, plain and simple. It is also more reliable than the buddy system in an OOA situation. The OP asked a question about how to properly rig a pony bottle and more than one person has already replied with answers and pictures describing how to properly rig it and sling it on the left. I defer to those previous posts.

I, like others, would discourage back-mounting a pony for the same reasons as previously stated.

• the valve is most likely out of reach - not a great thing if the gas is off when you need it or it starts to free flow during a dive
• it is possible to breath off the wrong tank - and this apparently contributed to a fatality in the Straits of Mackinaw a few years back Diving accident on the Cedarville
• it is not easy to pass off the pony to another diver if they are the one with the OOA situation

Donning a pony is not without some new skills to learn however, and practice with the pony should be undertaken - ideally in a pool for the first few times.

Keep in mind that your pony is should not be included in your gas plan. If it is, then it is not a safety device and you would be better served by getting larger tanks. (Your back may not be better served by this!)

Catastrophic failure near the end of a deeper recreational dive can empty your cylinder rapidly. Having a redundant gas supply is a great way to mitigate this risk, no matter how small the risk is. The buddy system is good for many things, but also has its drawbacks. Personally, I do not want to rely on someone else to carry my emergency gas supply. For this reason I often travel with a pony. A 19 cuft - while not ideal in volume - will fit in a suitcase easily. A 30 cuft cylinder or large offers enough gas to make relaxed ascent from ANY recreational depth.

OP is making a smart decision adding to a redundant gas supply. Practice using it and diving with it. Hopefully he never needs to use it.

 

[barth]

Anyone in this thread that is decrying the use of a redundant gas supply as a mistake and or evidence of a lack of skills should seriously revisit their choice of hobby. In what world is adding a measure of safety a sign of a bad diver?


A redundant gas supply is a safety device, plain and simple. It is also more reliable than the buddy system in an OOA situation. The OP asked a question about how to properly rig a pony bottle and more than one person has already replied with answers and pictures describing how to properly rig it and sling it on the left. I defer to those previous posts.

I, like others, would discourage back-mounting a pony for the same reasons as previously stated.

• the valve is most likely out of reach - not a great thing if the gas is off when you need it or it starts to free flow during a dive
• it is possible to breath off the wrong tank - and this apparently contributed to a fatality in the Straits of Mackinaw a few years back Diving accident on the Cedarville
• it is not easy to pass off the pony to another diver if they are the one with the OOA situation

Donning a pony is not without some new skills to learn however, and practice with the pony should be undertaken - ideally in a pool for the first few times.

Keep in mind that your pony is should not be included in your gas plan. If it is, then it is not a safety device and you would be better served by getting larger tanks. (Your back may not be better served by this!)

Catastrophic failure near the end of a deeper recreational dive can empty your cylinder rapidly. Having a redundant gas supply is a great way to mitigate this risk, no matter how small the risk is. The buddy system is good for many things, but also has its drawbacks. Personally, I do not want to rely on someone else to carry my emergency gas supply. For this reason I often travel with a pony. A 19 cuft - while not ideal in volume - will fit in a suitcase easily. A 30 cuft cylinder or large offers enough gas to make relaxed ascent from ANY recreational depth.

OP is making a smart decision adding to a redundant gas supply. Practice using it and diving with it. Hopefully he never needs to use it.

Ok the pony is not included in the gas plan. Please tell me why you want to give it to your buddy in an ooa siuation.

I think a lot of things go wrong.

- your buddy had an failure or he did not check his gas.
- you did not check your gas or had a poor gasplanning if you don't have enough gas in a single tank for both divers.

If your buddy had a failure than he did nothing wrong.

If you had a poor gasplanning you buddy should told you before the dive started.

If you didn't check your gas during the dive than you are a poor buddy.

I did stop counting dives, but there is always enough gas left in my tank when diving single tank for me and my buddy to make an ascend. If my buddy has a failure and loose all his gas than there is no need for a pony.

I would consider using a ponybottle when diving single tank if I think it would make sense. But I don't think there are situations for me where a ponybottle would make sense.

For me it would also not make sense to use a 19 cuft ponybottle because it would fit easy in a suitcase. Than I would just bring my own stagerigging and use a 80 cuft.

 

[Hatul]

Some great advice and if the OP doesn't mind I'll share some too. First I would get a few more dives under your belt. Next as you already have a 30cf (which I also use) PADI has a course called "Self Reliant" other agencies call it "Solo". Really it's there to teach you to be prepared for emergencies and as the name says to be self reliant. In this course they will help you with the rigging and proper ways to deploy/use your redundant air source. And don't get caught up with all this crap as to which side to mount your tank. I sling mine on the right side because I have my Oceanic ProPlus computer on the left and if I had my tank on the left side it would be tough to read my computer.

Just remember to get some more dives in and that will help you feel more comfortable in the water. And then get some additional training on the use of your tank. Good luck and I hope you enjoy diving as much as I do.

I also sling a small pony bottle from the right side when diving solo. I use a short hose and coming from the right it does not have to go over my neck. All the regs come from the right side. My rule is to use a 13 cu ft tank for dives <60 ft or so and 19 cu ft for deeper no deco dives. I also take two lbs of lead off from the side of the pony to maintain balance and reduce weight.

 

[73diver]

I'll share what I do. This is based on requirements and/or instruction. For public safety diving, I have the pony tank mounted to the right (my right) of the main tank. There are team protocols, plumbing considerations and a switch valve that dictate this practice. This is not my preferred location for a pony when I am sport diving. For either rebreather or solo sport diving I was taught to sling a 40CF AL on the left side. My sling consists of a large hose clamp encased in tubular nylon webbing with a bolt snap about in the middle of the tank and a three inch bungee and bolt snap around the valve neck. I prefer this rigging to the commercial rigging that places a bolt snap four inches down from the neck and another about 8 inches from the bottom. With the commercial system, the tank valve and first stage 'hang down' below my body. With my bungee neck strap (taught to me by a rebreather instructor) the 2nd stage stays bungeed to the tank and is approximately under my left armpit. Others that I dive with have similar systems.

 

[smellysocks]

Ok the pony is not included in the gas plan. Please tell me why you want to give it to your buddy in an ooa siuation.

I think a lot of things go wrong.

- your buddy had an failure or he did not check his gas.
- you did not check your gas or had a poor gasplanning if you don't have enough gas in a single tank for both divers.

If your buddy had a failure than he did nothing wrong.

If you had a poor gasplanning you buddy should told you before the dive started.

If you didn't check your gas during the dive than you are a poor buddy.

I did stop counting dives, but there is always enough gas left in my tank when diving single tank for me and my buddy to make an ascend. If my buddy has a failure and loose all his gas than there is no need for a pony.

I would consider using a ponybottle when diving single tank if I think it would make sense. But I don't think there are situations for me where a ponybottle would make sense.

For me it would also not make sense to use a 19 cuft ponybottle because it would fit easy in a suitcase. Than I would just bring my own stagerigging and use a 80 cuft.

Barth,

You pony is not part of your gas plan, it is a piece of safety gear for an emergency. Period. You plan you dive with your back gas and ONLY your back gas. You turn your dive at one third (or whatever your plan entails) and exit the water having never used your pony unless there was an OOA issue.

Why would you want to give your pony to your buddy? This is pretty simple. If your buddy has an OOA situation, it is much simpler to put them on your pony and clip it off on their gear, call the dive and you both make a slow and safe ascent. It is far easier and safer to ascend without being tethered to another diver's octo. This is the same logic as diving a long hose configuration. It is easier than sharing air on a shorter hose. Handing off a pony is easier still.

You keep reiterating how bad your buddy is and keeps running out of gas. This is a red herring and has no bearing what so ever on the usefulness of redundant gas supply. If your buddy cannot manage his gas,get a new buddy. The time to solve that problem is NOT when you are underwater. Share air, get to surface alive and then you can do whatever you want about your buddy troubles.

Good for you for always having enough gas in reserve for your buddy and yourself to ascend on. This is again, irrelevant. Your buddy continues to be tethered to you. If you can hand off the pony and ascend, it is easier, safer and is less stressful on a diver that has just run out of gas for whatever reason.

Whether or not you think a pony makes sense is entirely up to you. You are playing russian roulette and you can determine how many bullets you want to put in the gun at the outset. Plan and simple, it is safer to have a redundant air source that it is to not have one.

And yes, you can certainly travel with a sling kit. It is more cumbersome to dive with an 80 than it is with a 19, but it is not impossible. The problem with an 80, is that the bulk of that tank may lead some divers to say... "I don't need it on this dive." and then leave it behind. An 80 is also far more gas than you need on a recreational dive for a safety device. Personally, I often sling an 80, however that is as a stage bottle and not as a pony. Some divers may be tempted to start using the 80 as part of the gas plan, and thus it ceases to be as effective as a safety device.

 

[Peter69_56]

Barth,

You pony is not part of your gas plan, it is a piece of safety gear for an emergency. Period. You plan you dive with your back gas and ONLY your back gas. You turn your dive at one third (or whatever your plan entails) and exit the water having never used your pony unless there was an OOA issue.

Why would you want to give your pony to your buddy? This is pretty simple. If your buddy has an OOA situation, it is much simpler to put them on your pony and clip it off on their gear, call the dive and you both make a slow and safe ascent. It is far easier and safer to ascend without being tethered to another diver's octo. This is the same logic as diving a long hose configuration. It is easier than sharing air on a shorter hose. Handing off a pony is easier still.

You keep reiterating how bad your buddy is and keeps running out of gas. This is a red herring and has no bearing what so ever on the usefulness of redundant gas supply. If your buddy cannot manage his gas,get a new buddy. The time to solve that problem is NOT when you are underwater. Share air, get to surface alive and then you can do whatever you want about your buddy troubles.

Good for you for always having enough gas in reserve for your buddy and yourself to ascend on. This is again, irrelevant. Your buddy continues to be tethered to you. If you can hand off the pony and ascend, it is easier, safer and is less stressful on a diver that has just run out of gas for whatever reason.

Whether or not you think a pony makes sense is entirely up to you. You are playing russian roulette and you can determine how many bullets you want to put in the gun at the outset. Plan and simple, it is safer to have a redundant air source that it is to not have one.

And yes, you can certainly travel with a sling kit. It is more cumbersome to dive with an 80 than it is with a 19, but it is not impossible. The problem with an 80, is that the bulk of that tank may lead some divers to say... "I don't need it on this dive." and then leave it behind. An 80 is also far more gas than you need on a recreational dive for a safety device. Personally, I often sling an 80, however that is as a stage bottle and not as a pony. Some divers may be tempted to start using the 80 as part of the gas plan, and thus it ceases to be as effective as a safety device.[/QUOTE]

Have to agree with you. the pony is an EMERGENCY supply and on 99% of the dives should never be required. If you are thinking of using it to extend the dive its then not your backup and just another part of your gas supply, which I think is not what you are intending.

I agree with the comment, if your buddy is constantly a gas hog and runing out of gas, either he gets more gas so he doesnt run out of gas, or you get a new buddy. That would be my approach.

Also agree with the comment that its easier and far safer for all to simply hand the pony to the diver requiring gas, clipping it off. If in bad conditions or strong current, then both divers have their gas even if split up. I also try and ensure that the diver with LOW air has a backup and is on it BEFORE they are out of gas if possible. In this way they have the pony, and perhaps a little gas in their back cylinder as well for emergency or BCD inflation if the surface is rough etc.

If I dive recreationally I often take a sling kit and sling an 80, as extra gas for everyone in the group (and not only me). I prefer to err towards safety for all rather than have the "I'm alright mate, stuff you" approach which some appear to have. Occassionally I stage it off on the bottom but it is the emergency supply and NOT part of the gas plan for the dive.

When I dive tech its a whole different ball game!

 

[AfterDark]

OP I've tried both slinging on my right side and back mounting my 19cuft pony. I chose the back mounting. These are my reasons: Slinging I've found reduces my flexibility even my ability to put on my fins. The tank tends to hit objects. When diving in 1-5' vis one needs to get close to the bottom to see it, this puts the tank in close proximity to the bottom. Long hose? My pony is also my buddies emergency air so do use or need a long hose. My regulator on the pony has 46" long hose. I don't use a octopus, ever. My left side has my HP hose for my SPG that is in my console along with a compass that I use a lot. The pony would be in the way on the left. I made my own mounting device that can go from one tank to another without tools, buckles or straps. Lately I've been pondering getting a 6cuft for solo diving. After all I just need enough to get to the surface 3-6 breaths is more than enough; for me anyway.

As for reaching the valve, my solution was to put an on/off switch on my second stage and OVP valve on the 1st stage, which allows me to keep the valve wide open all the time.

My diving consists of diving mostly solo from shore and from my yak in the dark cold waters of New England, very little travel or charters. What I do suits this kind of diving, you and others may have different needs or requirements.