ABC Primetime Deep, Deep Diver Story
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brutus_scuba
Guest
I have a few responses I would like to give my two cents worth.
FIRST- WALTER, I lurk these boards much more than I post, but I have become familiar with your posting and have much respect for your opinion. It is aparent in every post that you hold safety paramount, but also have a very level head with a lot of common sense. I have learned a lot from your posting. That being said you and I can not understand what drives these guys. I think going as deep as they did is a bad decision b/c I would not do it. I think diving a rebreather is dangerous and I would not do it. this does not make decisions to do such bad decisions if the diver fully understands what challenge he/she is accepting. When you have the conviction that you need to do something, you weigh the risk and reward and still feel convicted/morally compelled to do it because it will serve someone else. That is heroic. Being heroic means that you put something on the line to serve someone else. In all fairness Dave made mistakes obvioiusly, like allowing some camera man to convince him to change his gear configuration. However, he had successfully completed a deep dive before, he had dove in that exact location before. He completed safe dives at amazing depths I wouldn't dream of before. Deciding to accept a new challenge is not bad decisions or a death wish. He knew the risk and accepted it. Astrountauts know the risk they accept stepping on a shuttle. People who died in the Challenger and Columbia disasters are still heros because they risked their lives to provide research opportunities.
Any PSD is a hero. They put their life on the line in very dangerous situations all the time to save victims and recover bodies. Many times body searches are called off for the safety of the divers but in this case you have to remember that Dave though he could recover the body decided it was worth it to him and even more so b/c he was one of a handful of people on god's green earth that could.
P.S. While were at it thank you to all PSD's
PERRONE-FORD--Yes I too noticed many inaccuracies but you need to remember the story was put together for the general public. If you start getting into gear configuration the general public will lose interest, and it's hard for us to believe but my parents get confused about the term dry-suit they thought it was the hard hat navy diving. So I understand why abc keeps it simple and think it's good that at least it gains respect for the people in scuba who are beyond special.
MARSHALLKARP- I understand why you would think that proffesional Recovery teams should have made the attempt other than one thing. THERE ISN'T A RECOVERY TEAM ONT HE PLANET THAT HAD DIVERS THAT GO HALF THAT DEEP. You have to remeber what they said at the beginning there are more people on this earth that have walked on the moon then have dove that deep. I respect the people involved in body recoveries and police divers, but remember one thing, like anything else there are good and bad groups out there, and there are police units out there that leave a lot to be desired in water skills. There are PSD's that love diving just look at Gary on this board. There are many PSD's who are great divers. But many get caught up in training for the recoveries for training in swift water or training in black water, training to recover evidence right ect. ect. and most of their true loves are for solving a crime or for being a law enforcement officer, and the matter of the fact is that most Public Safety Divers are not going to get into Rebreathers and Trimix and Staged Decompression on their own time and dollar (very few divers in general do) I think it's admirable tha he took on a challenge b/c he respected the gift he had that so very few elsewhere do.
FIRST- WALTER, I lurk these boards much more than I post, but I have become familiar with your posting and have much respect for your opinion. It is aparent in every post that you hold safety paramount, but also have a very level head with a lot of common sense. I have learned a lot from your posting. That being said you and I can not understand what drives these guys. I think going as deep as they did is a bad decision b/c I would not do it. I think diving a rebreather is dangerous and I would not do it. this does not make decisions to do such bad decisions if the diver fully understands what challenge he/she is accepting. When you have the conviction that you need to do something, you weigh the risk and reward and still feel convicted/morally compelled to do it because it will serve someone else. That is heroic. Being heroic means that you put something on the line to serve someone else. In all fairness Dave made mistakes obvioiusly, like allowing some camera man to convince him to change his gear configuration. However, he had successfully completed a deep dive before, he had dove in that exact location before. He completed safe dives at amazing depths I wouldn't dream of before. Deciding to accept a new challenge is not bad decisions or a death wish. He knew the risk and accepted it. Astrountauts know the risk they accept stepping on a shuttle. People who died in the Challenger and Columbia disasters are still heros because they risked their lives to provide research opportunities.
Any PSD is a hero. They put their life on the line in very dangerous situations all the time to save victims and recover bodies. Many times body searches are called off for the safety of the divers but in this case you have to remember that Dave though he could recover the body decided it was worth it to him and even more so b/c he was one of a handful of people on god's green earth that could.
P.S. While were at it thank you to all PSD's
PERRONE-FORD--Yes I too noticed many inaccuracies but you need to remember the story was put together for the general public. If you start getting into gear configuration the general public will lose interest, and it's hard for us to believe but my parents get confused about the term dry-suit they thought it was the hard hat navy diving. So I understand why abc keeps it simple and think it's good that at least it gains respect for the people in scuba who are beyond special.
MARSHALLKARP- I understand why you would think that proffesional Recovery teams should have made the attempt other than one thing. THERE ISN'T A RECOVERY TEAM ONT HE PLANET THAT HAD DIVERS THAT GO HALF THAT DEEP. You have to remeber what they said at the beginning there are more people on this earth that have walked on the moon then have dove that deep. I respect the people involved in body recoveries and police divers, but remember one thing, like anything else there are good and bad groups out there, and there are police units out there that leave a lot to be desired in water skills. There are PSD's that love diving just look at Gary on this board. There are many PSD's who are great divers. But many get caught up in training for the recoveries for training in swift water or training in black water, training to recover evidence right ect. ect. and most of their true loves are for solving a crime or for being a law enforcement officer, and the matter of the fact is that most Public Safety Divers are not going to get into Rebreathers and Trimix and Staged Decompression on their own time and dollar (very few divers in general do) I think it's admirable tha he took on a challenge b/c he respected the gift he had that so very few elsewhere do.
brutus_scuba
Guest
That's an example I used with in another debate with friends to try to convince people that these guys were not crazy just pushing the envelope, and being heroic.PerroneFord:
PerroneFord:
http://www.gue.com/Projects/WKPP/History/18ka.html
this says 8.5 on the record penetration..... but hey, that's hollywood.
Rainer
Contributor
scubatexastony:
Way to link to a dive report from eight years ago. Try searching again...
1_T_Submariner
Contributor
Very well done show. I thought it was probably about as accurate as the mass media gets. I think the article was better written than the TV show though.
PerroneFord
Contributor
scubatexastony:
Try this one:
http://www.gue.com/Expeditions/WKPP/Updates/wkpp-may19.html
I was there.
I'll spare you some of the reading:
PerroneFord:
......that says J or others do this EVERY other weekend as you pointed out.
"It had been almost 6 years since the team supported a 24 hour operation and my compliments to the entire support and surface management team for an outstanding job. The October, 2005 dive at Chip's Hole came close to 24 hours"
you were there? why?
p1medicshawn
Registered
Not sure if this question has been asked and answered? I know very little about tech diving. Could someone inform me why Dave could not loop his light around his head with the helmet camera and had to let it hang at his side? Is this because they were afraid that it would alter the angle of the camera? I read the article and saw the show. I think that the show was definately geared towards the public to keep there interest. Either way,,,Thank you to all involved for your time and dedication. A job well done.
DiveMaven
Contributor
My husband and I taped it and watched it last night. The biggest lesson we took from this tragedy was never to change gear configurations when doing something new. Something as simple as not looping his light around his neck appeared to have a huge consequence, resulting in his death.
We also got chills that he ultimately accomplished his goal of bringing the other guy's body up for the family.
I agree that Primetime did a good job being respectful and kept to the story well.
We also got chills that he ultimately accomplished his goal of bringing the other guy's body up for the family.
I agree that Primetime did a good job being respectful and kept to the story well.
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