Bodies Recovered in School Sink aka Wayne's World, Hudson, FL

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The only level 2 cave certification I am aware of is GUE's Cave 2, which I'm sure they were not. I believe you mean they were Intro/Basic certified based on what I have read on other forums. Actually, I read one was Intro and the other was not even cavern, but that could be misinformation. Regardless, Wayne's World is an advanced cave dive. It is owned by the CDS and the CDS requires a minimum of Abe Davis level (100 safe cave dives post full cave training) before you are given access to the system. That would indicate these 2 divers were trespassing. WW is a deep, dark system where even very experienced cave divers have had issues. I believe it can also be tidally effected. I've never been to Wayne's World, but I have been in systems like it. It is definitely not a place for inexperience.

bpd, I'm not familiar with "lvl 7 cave system". Can you provide me a link to this grading system? Also, do you know if the divers were in single tanks or doubles?

It was a trespass situation. If you are not on the updated list or have current card Scuba West does not give you the code, period. I have seen Alex Warren turned away for having outdated card and most of us know his credentials. Regardless of situation it is a very sad event.
 
I can honestly say that this is a TOTAL reality check for me - this unfortunate event really stresses the importance of diving within my own trianing/personal limits.

And Walter, It appears you are deeply affected by this tragic loss, but you I have to say - your post is pretty harsh. (No, i dont know bpd)
 
Actually, I think the mod edited it :wink: "Last edited by Rick Murchison; Today at 11:12 PM. Reason: TOS compliance"
(Wonder why)
 
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looks like you edited your post while i wrote mine...

No I edited it. I need to let official word come out. My apologies.
 
I am very curious as to who you are. You are talking a pretty good game but I am not aware of anyone that was on the phone with you during the recovery operation. I am also not sure where you are getting your information about cave certifications because you are 100% wrong.

I'm with Walter on this one. I was with someone who "was on the phone" with the recovery team, who also knows the specifics of one of the divers' certification levels, and bpd's information is inaccurate. I'm not saying that bpd is trying to spread misinformation. It is possible bpd was speaking to someone from the sherrif's dept or some medical first responder, but not the actual cave diving recovery team.

The cave diving community is pretty tight, and there are much less than six degrees of separation. For those who are not cave divers, it is probably important to know that the people who risk their lives to go into a potentially hazardous situation to rescue cave divers or, sadly in this case, recover their bodies are extremely advanced divers who do this on a volunteer basis, and put themselves in grave peril every time they are involved in the recovery. These are typically not (except in a few situations) the local law enforcement dive team. They are realtors, insructors, system analysts, etc. In other words, just amazing people who volunteer to do a hazardous and risky job.

After the rescue/recovery, the wok does not stop there. The IUCRR (International Underwater Cave Rescue and Recovery will analyze all of the data recovered by the team (where were the bodies found, what was the condition of the cave, the line, the equipment, witness statements (if there are any), training levels and experience, etc) and develop an accident analysis. This can take quite some time, due to the need for law enforcement to also complete their investigation, etc. Until that time, much of the information released can be hearsay, speculation, etc. This is not to say that there are not lessons to be learned, just to caution that a complete reporting of the accident may take a while.

It is a sad day when any diver is lost. It is also a blow to the cave diving community to lose one of their own, let alone two. As I mentioned, the community is tight and interconnected. As I am sobered by the loss of these two diver, I also want to take a moment to express my deepest gratitude to those who risked their lives to bring these divers home to their families to rest in peace.

Don
 
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From TBO.com:

Bodies Found In Dive Cave ID'd As Hillsborough Men

HUDSON - The Pasco County Sheriff's Office has identified the two divers whose bodies were found Wednesday night in underwater caves in Pasco County.

Joseph Christian Hartranft, 52, of 1504 Scotch Pine Drive in Brandon, and Yessic Cozay Spencer, 52, a Marine from Gainesville based at MacDill Air Force Base, were found in School Sink, a cave-diving spot on Stevens Drive near Old Dixie Highway.

The divers had been reported missing since Tuesday from Hillsborough County. The vehicle of one of the men was found Wednesday night near the entrance to School Sink.

The Pasco County Sheriff's office contracted divers, who found the bodies about 6:30 p.m., about 30 minutes after their search began.

One body was found near the entrance of School Sink, less than 50 feet from the surface. The other diver was found in a side tunnel, sheriff's office spokesman Kevin Doll said.

The area where the men were found is privately owned, Doll said. Other than issuing trespass violations, there's really nothing law enforcement can do to prevent people from diving at the site, Doll said today.

It's not clear what kind of experience the two divers had prior to the dive. They appeared to have the right equipment, Doll said.

"It comes down to personal responsibility. If you're not certified to skydive, you don't jump out of a plane," Doll said. "Cave diving is one of the most dangerous sports in the world."


Here's the link to the story: http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/nov/13/names-divers-found-caves-be-released/news-metro/

My thoughts and prayers go out to the loved ones.
 
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These 2 gentlemen were my dive instructors. I was just certified at the end of October. The was always talking about being safe but would then tell stories about "I know these guys that did this etc,...."
I mourn the loss of both of these veterans.

Officials identify dead divers - Bay News 9
 
These 2 gentlemen were my dive instructors.......


This would certainly imply that the deceased divers were instructors, so I think that for all new and experienced divers reading this thread, the message is no matter what you experience or training, if you exceed it, you run very serious risks. Understand those risks before you decide to take them or even better, don't take them at all. As stated earlier, errors are not often forgiven in scuba diving.
 

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