New to DSLR with a question about lenses and ports

[Korsu]

Warren does the D3x have the menu option to switch to Dx (sensor crop)? The D3s does but this option comes at the expense of loosing megapixels. Although with the D3x not as big a problem and that would be a neat way to get a few more inches of working distance with the 60 mm while underwater. Just switch from Fx to Dx mode. `

 

[AussieByron]

As someone who as transitioned from a DX body to a FX body and has used both the 60mm and 105mm extensively on both bodies, I can offer you my personal views on using these lenses on an FX body like the D700 from personal experience.

First it should be noted that I have been shooting with a D3 (FX body, with a near identical sensor to the D700) for the past two years. I have also recently acquired a D3X which I can use interchangeably with the D3 in the same housing, which I have used primarily for macro.

First, to be technically correct, a 60mm lens or a 105mm lens is always 60mm or 105mm lens whether on a DX body or FX body. The conversion factor (crop factor) of 1.5 on a DX body may refer to an equivalent focal length, however, in respect of this, it is just the angle of view that is equivalent, nothing else. If you take a 28mm lens and put it on a DX body, you may get an equivalent focal length of 42mm, however, the lens still displays the refractive properties of the 28mm lens. If you compare this versus a true 42mm lens on an FX body you will see differences in the image even though the angle of view may be the same.

When I moved to the full frame, I expected the same as what Mark has indicated - that I would find the 60mm less useful and begin to use the 105mm more to keep the equivalent angle of view. However, that has not been the case. With the FX sensors of my D3 and D3x I find myself continuing to use the 60mm more than the 105mm. I still find it quite a bit easier to use and still quite versatile. I still use the 105mm on occasion, but if I'm not sure exactly what I am going to see from a macro perspective, I will always take the 60mm with me.

Here are a few shots from a few weeks ago in Bonaire, all shot with the 60mm.

Hi Warren,

Thank you for your interesting post as a first hand user and correcting my expectations on how the 60mm vs 105mm is seen on a Fx camera.

So am I correct in my calculations that a 60mm macro on a DX camera has the equivalent focal length of 90mm on a FX camera?

So as someone that has experience in both Dx anf Fx formats you see the difference in focal length between the 60mm on each camera? Do you find using the 60mm on the FX scaring away critters more so than with the 60mm on the DX as you have to be closer still than the 60mm on Dx?

Do you have issues with strobe placement which macro subject close to your port??

Do you have issues with obtaining 1:1 which the 60mm on the D3/x and how far away do you have to be to get these shots?

How does the 105mm on the Fx comapre side by side with the 60mm on the DX.

Regards Mark

 

[Warren_L]

Hi Warren,

Thank you for your interesting post as a first hand user and correcting my expectations on how the 60mm vs 105mm is seen on a Fx camera.

So am I correct in my calculations that a 60mm macro on a DX camera has the equivalent focal length of 90mm on a FX camera?

So as someone that has experience in both Dx anf Fx formats you see the difference in focal length between the 60mm on each camera? Do you find using the 60mm on the FX scaring away critters more so than with the 60mm on the DX as you have to be closer still than the 60mm on Dx?

Do you have issues with strobe placement which macro subject close to your port??

Do you have issues with obtaining 1:1 which the 60mm on the D3/x and how far away do you have to be to get these shots?

How does the 105mm on the Fx comapre side by side with the 60mm on the DX.

Regards Mark

Hi Mark, first, I would be hesitant to say that I am "correcting" you since I am offering up my opinion, which may very well differ from others who have migrated from a DX to a FX body. As I said, before going to the FX sensor, what you stated was also my expectation at the time.

You are correct in that a 60mm lens on a DX body has an equivalent angle of view to a 90mm lens on a FX body. The focal length stays the same regardless of what body a lens is on. I think this is an important distinction that the crop factor issue has confused people.

For the shooting that I do, I've not really noticed any significant greater difficulty in getting closer to subjects than I did with the 60mm on a DX body. Perhaps I have not shot long enough with it to tell. I'm sure that given the shorter working distance to fill the frame the same way, that, by virtue, will make things more difficult to some degree ... However, the degree to which, I am uncertain and for me, at least for the moment, has not really been noticeable.

I do notice that strobe placement is a bit tighter, but still manageable. One of the issues that I have found is that I really need to power down the strobes a bit more and use a higher f stop and lower ISO. Getting 1:1 is not an issue, but you do so at the same distance regardless of whether you are on a DX body or FX body. It's just that on the FX body you get a wider view of the image which will make it seem a little less close perhaps, but it is still 1:1.

The 105mm on the FX body is still tighter than the 60mm on the DX body. One notable difference is that the viewfinder is 100% on the D3 but not on the D200, which may skew my perception of the 60mm a little bit.

 

[Warren_L]

Warren does the D3x have the menu option to switch to Dx (sensor crop)? The D3s does but this option comes at the expense of loosing megapixels. Although with the D3x not as big a problem and that would be a neat way to get a few more inches of working distance with the 60 mm while underwater. Just switch from Fx to Dx mode. `

To be honest with you, I'm not sure. I'd have to go have a look. I know the D3 has one, so I would suspect the D3x would as well. The problem is, I never use it. All that really does is to inactivate the outer pixels, so rather than doing that, I could achieve the same end result by taking a full frame shot in FX mode and then crop out the edges. This way, there is a bit more lee-way as can choose the crop and I will have more of the image to work with.

 

[randytay]

I've been saving for a new system and have decided on a Nikon D700 and Ikelite housing. I've been shooting P&S cameras for the past seven years and want to start with a full frame model rather than trade up later.
I've picked out the D700 with Ikelite housing, Nikon AF-S Nikkor 16-35mm f/4G ED VR Wide Angle Zoom Lens with Ikelite Dome Port 5503.80, Nikon AF-S Micro-Nikkor 60mm f/2.8G ED Macro Autofocus Lens with Ikelite Flat Port 5502.41 and two SubStrobe DS-160s. Is there anything wrong with these choices or would you recommend anything else?

Ugh! I get very disturbed when people says getting a aps-C to a full frame is a "trade up" or "upgrade". They are not. they are just different formats, period. Both formats have their pros and cons, and a "full frame" is not exactly "superior" to a 1.5x or 1.6x sensor.

In the same way, a hasselblad is not an "upgrade" to a 35mm format because despite the "higher specs", it cannot do what a D3 or D3s can do. They are different formats, thats it.

Anyway, back to your question: If I were you, I would go with the D300s. Why? It could do 99% everything the D700 can, cheaper, and do 720p videos.

*end of rant.

 

[randytay]

To be honest with you, I'm not sure. I'd have to go have a look. I know the D3 has one, so I would suspect the D3x would as well. The problem is, I never use it. All that really does is to inactivate the outer pixels, so rather than doing that, I could achieve the same end result by taking a full frame shot in FX mode and then crop out the edges. This way, there is a bit more lee-way as can choose the crop and I will have more of the image to work with.

Yes it does. But why bother? You can crop it in post and have the same effect.

 

[randytay]

Hi Warren,


So as someone that has experience in both Dx anf Fx formats you see the difference in focal length between the 60mm on each camera? Do you find using the 60mm on the FX scaring away critters more so than with the 60mm on the DX as you have to be closer still than the 60mm on Dx?

Do you have issues with obtaining 1:1 which the 60mm on the D3/x and how far away do you have to be to get these shots?

How does the 105mm on the Fx comapre side by side with the 60mm on the DX.

Regards Mark

You cannot really get 1:1 with the 60 on FX if you are shooting shrimps. You will be right up close to the subject. 60 is better on the DX for macro. However, if Macro is only part of the equation, it would be more versatile on an FX.

 

[Warren_L]

Yes it does. But why bother? You can crop it in post and have the same effect.

Ummm.... isn't that what I just said?