Out of Air at 84 ft

[JulieannevZ]

I got a lot out of reading this thread. It's really made me think about what I would do.

First of all, like others have said, I wouldn't let myself get out of air anyway. I watch my guage like a hawk as soon as it goes under 150.

And, if I was in that situation, I would probably just naturally ascend without even thinking about it. I think I'd be so concerned, I wouldn't be able to stop myself from ascending.

 

[TrueGreenMarine]

I have gone on deep dives and would never even consider doing so unless I was 100% confident in my buddy. I was doing a deep dive to 350 ft and my light went out. Thank God my buddy was close by because I was getting worried after 15 seconds, (which seemed like an hour.) He was much more experienced too and he shined his light on himself, signalled that everything was O.K. and gave me his spare. I was so grateful I could have kissed him and I'm a Marine Hoo Ahhh.LOL Thank God we had all that equipment on or I might have. LOL
Seriously though, I have heard so many horror stories about people getting hurt or killed when the buddy system was not applied or taken as serious as life or death, which is what it is down there.

Hmmm ... lemme see, what might I do if I find myself diving with a buddy who can't stay within a kick or two ...

1) I might decide not to go very deep ... say, stay within a range where I know I would have a reasonable chance of reaching the surface if the hit fit the shan.
I agree. I have been on some deep dives and would never consider going down even that far if i wasn't 100% confident in my buddy being close by and AT LEAST checking on me once every few minutes, as I would him or her.


2) I might decide to pay closer attention to my SPG, and start my ascent with a little extra gas to spare.

3) I might even decide to thumb the dive as soon as I realize that we're going to have issues diving as a team ... after all, it ain't like the dive is worth my life or anything.

Speculation is OK I guess ... but the real answer is don't put yourself into the situation ... you have lots of options in a case like that. Diving is all about using good judgment. You need to understand that not doing so can kill you.

Lots of things in life are like that ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[lostinspace]

Thank god for buddies, is all I can say.
On my very first OW dive ever at 13m (39ft) my mask popped open & the lenses fell out.
I have to say I panicked and bolted to the surface forgetting to breathe. My instructor was right next to me, held me down by grabbing my BCD and slowed me down. When he realised I wasnt breathing he went face to face with me and pointed out I should breathe. In those couple of minutes getting to surface I had calmed down again.
If I was ever in the original circumstance, now that I am calmer and much more experienced and more confident in my breath hold abilities I would say I would try to swim to my buddy. But I am also quite naturally constantly assessing if I am able to swim to my buddy if he has wandered off or accidentally fallen behind. If the current/drift is too strong then I assess how far I can swim on breath hold. That way on each and every dive I know what judgement I would take. Yes, I do always assess this on each dive.
I also know from experience the ache you get (luckily no broken ribs) from holding your breath whilst ascending and whilst breathing out in an OOA situation does not instinctively feel right, I know that it is right.

 

[GDI]

Having read through most of the postings here I think you get the gest of what everyone is saying. However I find it odd that how everyone is saying one thing and most actually do what your initial posting stated- failure to communicate and maintain safe contact as a buddy.

Consider this:
1. First!, It is unacceptable to run low or out of air at any time - Gas Management and Equipment Maintenace are your responsibility. In a worst case scenario of an all out gas loss. If you need air you get air, breathable air, it does not matter from who or where. If it is a new or an unsuspecting diver is doesn't matter you get air and you come up. Pick One: Live or Die?

2. Plan the Dive Together, Dive the Plan Together - Include in your dive plan: team communication, formation and separation techniques/practices. If you have a new diver that you have never made a dive with take the time to get to know them and get a feel for them, you can always change the dive plan. Tell them what you expect of them. If during the dive they don't want to play by the teams rules then thumb the dive. If the dive requires additional planning or has greater depth then don't include that new diver in your dive planning, have a preset team (84 ft is not that deep,IMO)

3. Self dependency. Are your skills and equipment configuration suitable for you to do the dive with a self dependency and reliance. If not then you need to go back and practice. If you need to rely on another diver for your safety then I suggest your skills are not where they need to be. This does not mean that you dive without a buddy it means you need to be solely responsible to yourself first and then your buddy. Diving is a Social activity with a Solo responsibility and part of that responsibility is buddy awareness and contactPOORLY TRAINED SKILLS ARE JUST THE SAME AS HAVING NO SKILLS

 

[Snowbear]

I also know from experience the ache you get (luckily no broken ribs) from holding your breath whilst ascending...

Broken ribs would have been the least of your worries :11: :11:

 

[perpet1]

I hate posting in threads with this many responses but here goes:

first: as was brought up in many posts there is really no reason short of catastrophic failure (and even then) to have a total OOA.

Next and more importantly, you need to be conditioned for such an event. It is not reasonable to assume you will respond correctly given an event you have not conditioned yourself for and believe me the training you get in your classes do not provide the conditioning you need over time. You need to work and practice continiously to get a true conditioned response.

What does thins mean? I actually perform a short mental exercise every dive (without exception). I will out of the blue say to myself "sh** I am out of air" and go through the actions (short of actually performing an ESA or grabing my partners reg) that I would need to do if it were the real thing. This forces me to ask the questions that I would need to ask in the event it actually happened, like can I make it to my buddy? can I make and ESA? what are the risks associated with each?. I feel that if I do this every dive then if the real thing ever happens then I get a conditioned response vs a responce that I need to apply thaught to. This exercise is short and simple and will also give me insite to my buddy skills.

Remember the key to not panicing is conditioned responses. Aslo, if you are well conditioned and you panic you may still live to tell the story since you body may have the ability to go into "criuse control"

Just a thaught,
Pete

 

[Keysdrifter454]

It doesn't matter what the reason is, you are at 84 ft and you're out of air. In the real world of diving we all know that at times your dive Buddy and you will be more than a few kicks from each other. It happens. You are not that familiar with each other. It's not a designated Buddy you went diving with. It's one you teamed up with on the boat, or a Buddy that was designated for you by the situation on the boat. All the other divers are also, like your buddy, about 20 to 30 ft away, below you, above you, on either side. You are sucking an empty reg, nothing is coming out. No air! As might be expected, you start to panic, get real concerned. You have to think very fast. You don't have minutes, you have seconds. What do you do?

ESA.

Your buddy 30 feet away is 25 ft too far to reach, especially since he doesn't know you're OOA.

I can swim over 150 underwater horizontaly with fins, and most could, with practice.

Making it up 84 feet would be a snap.

Staying next to your buddy is a snap, too...

 

[ewong]

Before your next dive, get two (not one) underwater noise makers, one for your buddy and one for you. At the pre-dive briefing agree to watch for each other if you hear the noise. Also check your air often, towards the end of a dive I usually check it every minute or so. When you learn to dive, you learn about prevention as well, you should never run into a situation like "oops out of air".


Eddy.

 

[lostinspace]

Broken ribs would have been the least of your worries :11: :11:

oh, I know. but as I said, this was my very very first open water dive way back when. I knew I was opening myself up for criticism by even posting this, but sometimes we need to be honest that we ourselves have panicked, but more importantly, how you learn from that situation.

 

[wreckferret146]

Having read through most of the postings here I think you get the gest of what everyone is saying. However I find it odd that how everyone is saying one thing and most actually do what your initial posting stated- failure to communicate and maintain safe contact as a buddy.

Consider this:
1. First!, It is unacceptable to run low or out of air at any time - Gas Management and Equipment Maintenace are your responsibility. In a worst case scenario of an all out gas loss. If you need air you get air, breathable air, it does not matter from who or where. If it is a new or an unsuspecting diver is doesn't matter you get air and you come up. Pick One: Live or Die?

2. Plan the Dive Together, Dive the Plan Together - Include in your dive plan: team communication, formation and separation techniques/practices. If you have a new diver that you have never made a dive with take the time to get to know them and get a feel for them, you can always change the dive plan. Tell them what you expect of them. If during the dive they don't want to play by the teams rules then thumb the dive. If the dive requires additional planning or has greater depth then don't include that new diver in your dive planning, have a preset team (84 ft is not that deep,IMO)

3. Self dependency. Are your skills and equipment configuration suitable for you to do the dive with a self dependency and reliance. If not then you need to go back and practice. If you need to rely on another diver for your safety then I suggest your skills are not where they need to be. This does not mean that you dive without a buddy it means you need to be solely responsible to yourself first and then your buddy. Diving is a Social activity with a Solo responsibility and part of that responsibility is buddy awareness and contactPOORLY TRAINED SKILLS ARE JUST THE SAME AS HAVING NO SKILLS

at last someone hit the nail on the head !!!!
self dependency look after yourself !! dont expect others to do it for you !! < unless being trained of course > you should have the skills and equipment get get out of most situations.. your buddy can help if needed... thats a bonus,,,
self dependency... like it !! brilliant feeling.. try it.....