oxygen narcosis

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I have been told many times that Oxygen and Nitrogen are more or less equally narcotic. I dont Know. I do know that Nitrogen Narcosis is worse in some people and in the same person different from day to day and dive to dive.Is it the same with O2
For example is diver #1 more narced by N than O2. Is diver#2 more narced by O2 . does it change from day to day .
Joens
 
Uncle Pug once bubbled...
...if your answer is no can you provide any data to back up your principles?

Dear Uncle Pug,

If you can provide any data, and I mean data not hearsay, which backs up either view it would be appreciated.

However, I consider O2 to be as narcotic as nitrogen, because using nitrox seems to make no difference to how narced I get and anyone else who tries to tell me otherwice can f%^* o(*! The most narced I have ever been was on EAN25 at 46M. I was a lot more narced than I have been at 60M on air.

Neoprene,

Si.
 
Its not known 100% yet that the O2 is a narcotic gas ……..
And even if it was we cant do anything about it,…
 
SimonN once bubbled...
Dear Uncle Pug,

If you can provide any data, and I mean data not hearsay, which backs up either view it would be appreciated.
I don't have any hard data to share in this regard...
Just personal observations.
 
I just want to add something here that there is some decompression softwear ask u if u are planning a deco dive if u want the O2 to be narcotic or not ……..i think after that the END should change ……………
 
AquaTec once bubbled...
Questions for you.

Is Oxygen as narcotic as Nitrogen.
Does Oxygen add to or inhance Nitrogen narcosis

If your answer is yes can you provide any data to back up your principles.

I posted a response here that includes a table showing the narcotic properties of certain gasses.

Perhaps this may help to answer your question.
 
The Meyer-Overton Rule is not neccesarily accurate. All it does is list the solubility of gasses in olive oil!

Seeing as most things that are narcotic are also toxic and O2 can also be toxic at relatively low pressures, I would expect some of the O2 narcosis to be realted to it's toxicity as well as lipid solubility. However, this is nothing but utter speculation as I have absolutely no medical training whatsoever (well, PADI MFA .:bonk:).

I just want to add something here that there is some decompression softwear ask u if u are planning a deco dive if u want the O2 to be narcotic or not ……..i think after that the END should change

Wazza, I wrote a post on another board regarding the difference between EAD and END... here it is...

How to calculate your EAD and END.

EAD stands for Equivalent Air Depth, which basically means 'If I am breathing a gas mix at a certain depth, what depth would I have to be at breathing air to have the same partial pressure of nitrogen'. This is useful for using Air tables when breathing nitrox and for getting an idea of the narcosis you may experience if you do not believe O2 to be narcotic.

END stands for Equivalent Narcotic Depth. This means 'If I am breathing a mix at a certain depth, what would be the equivalent depth I would have to be at breathing air to experience the same level of narcosis'. If you do not consider oxygen to be narcotic then this is the same as EAD. If you do consider O2 to be narcotic (which I do), then every nitrox mix has the same potential for narcosis.

There are several formulas out there to calculate EAD, but most are all overly complicated or differ depending on whether they are for metric or imperial. In my opinion anyone who dives nitrox regularily should be able to work in atomspheres (they needed to to get certified), so why complicate it? The easiest way to do it is to use the 'triangle' which represents Dalton's Law (as you should have been taught on your nitrox course)

i.e.

Pg
-----
fg | P

Which, to recap, means

Pg (partial pressure of a gas) = fg (fraction of a gas) * P (pressure in Ata)
fg = Pg / P
P = Pg / fg

P is the same as depth (it is not the depth we are worried about per se, but the pressure caused by being at that depth)

So using EAN25 at a depth of 40M as an example.

fg = 0.75 [1 (the complete mix) - 0.25 (fraction of O2) = 0.75 (fraction of N2)]
P = 5 [40M = (40/10)+1 = 5 ata]

Pg = 0.75 * 5 = 3.75

So the partial pressure of nitrogen when breathing EAN25 @ 40M is 3.75 ata.

To find out the EAD, we use Daltons Law again:

Pg = 3.75 (PP from above)
fg = 0.79 (fraction of nitrogen in air)

P = 3.75/0.79 = 4.746835443 ata or (4.75-1)*10 = 37.5M

Expressed in one formula:

EAD(ata) = [fN2 * Depth(ata)]/0.79
 
Hi Aquatec,

Was just doing some research on nitrogen narcosis, and came across this document. Thought it would help out the debate:

Oxygen Narcosis: Fact or Fiction?

Matt
 
Agree that narcosis is a more complex phenomenon than what the Myer-Overton Hypothesis can explain. Per Andrew, CO2 should be 25 times more narcotic than N2 according to Myer-Overton, but is actually 130 times. That makes the argument that O2 is narcotic suspect. This is one area I disagree with my DIR buddies and think that END equates to EAD. Anecdotal evidence based on the experiences of my wife and another individual with the same life style suggest that O2 is not a significant factor. Neither drink alcohol or take recreational pharmacuticals and both are very in tune to their response to N2 narcosis, which begins at 85 feet on air. On EAN32, that feeling isn't felt until 105 feet. Do the math and you come up with an EAD of 87 feet.
 
The two references that Sydney_Diver provided are essential to this discussion. Everyone would do well to review them before responding further. One of them was then re-referenced later in the thread. Those references pretty much summarize the scientific knowledge on the subject.

Rich
 

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