Pony bottle & recreational diving...Need input...

[Nemrod]

Why pay an instructor if you are intending to disregard his/her guidance? I see it often, newer divers with every gizmo and trinket the retail dive store they frequent has on their display rack. The OP may not fit this category but his instructor probably has seen the overly outfitted diver many times and is trying to impart a little wisdom.

Why shouldn't the instructor be critical of improper gear, incorrectly rigged or utilized gear or gear being used as a crutch to replace a skill. After all he is trying to increase the student divers knowledge and skill level. Being uneasy in the water and therefore carrying a plethora of redundant and extra gear to assuage these undefined fears is a skill/experience problem issue that the instructor may be trying to address.

N

 

[Coldwater_Canuck]

Personally, I'll never dive below 60 feet without a pony again. Too many things can go wrong. Having "good buddy's" isn't always an option if you go somewhere on your own: you get who you get. In Seattle, losing a buddy isn't particularly difficult when current picks up and vis is bad. In Ontario, freeze-ups are a serious concern (serious enough that someone on here said in the spring months one of the dive shops required redundancy just to enter the water from their boats).

The other thing I like is I can do realistic gas management. Unfortunately getting me and a buddy to the surface from 100 feet safely in a panicked situation could take up to 2000PSI of an AL-80: No way I can abort the dive after only 1000PSI. Most people won't do this, so they intentionally don't properly manage gas.

I'd at least use it for the deep dive.

 

[tomboyy]

I’m in a bit of a quandary. I have 38 dives now and am taking AOW. My instructor whom I like but who is a self confessed minimalist – doesn’t want glow sticks in night dive training for example), also does not like the 19 cu ft pony I usually wear attached to my main steel 100 with a “x bracket”, with a small Aeris Ion regulator clipped to the BCD. It’s a lot of comfort to me as a newer diver even though I have no intention at this time to exceed any of the recreational diver limits. He says I can keep it on if I must but he would prefer than within rec diving limits I minimize extra gear, trust what I have (Oceanic Delta 4 primary reg, never diving in water below 47 degrees), stay streamlined, etc. I have good air consumption – usually below 0.50 cu ft/min, often around 0.45 unless I am working hard on something, so I don’t have a lot of good arguments to keep it except for “what if” and “I take comfort in it”. Opinions?

Thats mighty nice of him.

Air consumption has nothing to do with a "Pony" except maybe when picking what size pony to buy.

There are the camps that will argue against a Pony and camps that will side with the Pony.

Read all you can on the subject, get Opinions from people you trust and in the end dive how YOU want to dive.

 

[tc]

I like your instructor's philosophy. Proper air management is the key. If you can't manage your air usage so you don't run out you shouldn't be diving.
Failure of properly maintained equipment is almost unheard of. In 50 years of diving I have never run out of air or had an equipment failure. There is reliability in simplicity.

I've had a (properly maintained) low pressure hose burst during a dive.

Equipment failures are not "almost unheard of", uncommon possibly, but they do happen.

Oh, and it didn't turn into an emergency or even much of a problem that day because I was wearing my pony.

 

[Nemrod]

I've had a (properly maintained) low pressure hose burst during a dive.

Equipment failures are not "almost unheard of", uncommon possibly, but they do happen.

Oh, and it didn't turn into an emergency or even much of a problem that day because I was wearing my pony.

If it burst how do you define "properly maintained?" Hoses don't just burst without a cause. Was it kinked, tugged, pulled on, had it been over pressured or was it old? Any of those things are reasons to reject a hose for continued use and replace with a new one. Those of us who eschew multiple levels of complex redundancy and instead replace it with reliable and simple components include equipment maintenance and INSPECTION as part of our system. That might explain why Captain has never had any equipment failures.

N

 

[captain]

So. with good gas management, you will ALMOST always be fine.

And your point is.
I have stated my personal experience and that is what I base my opinion on. Properly maintained breathing equipment will very very rarely fail of it own accord.

How much air is enough? In reality it is an unlimited amount. 19 extra cu/ft might be not be enough but 30 cu/ft could be or not.
Pick a number you feel will get you by 100% of the time no matter what the circumstance.

We are talking recreation limits here and in that setting I don't feel a pony is a necessary piece of gear.

 

[The Great Kazoo]

If it burst how do you define "properly maintained?" Hoses don't just burst without a cause. Was it kinked, tugged, pulled on, had it been over pressured or was it old? Any of those things are reasons to reject a hose for continued use and replace with a new one. Those of us who eschew multiple levels of complex redundancy and instead replace it with reliable and simple components include equipment maintenance and INSPECTION as part of our system. That might explain why Captain has never had any equipment failures.

N

That is like saying a Brand New Corvette will not break down. Mine did on the way home from the Dealer. Shtuff happens.

 

[tomboyy]

If it burst how do you define "properly maintained?" Hoses don't just burst without a cause. Was it kinked, tugged, pulled on, had it been over pressured or was it old? Any of those things are reasons to reject a hose for continued use and replace with a new one. Those of us who eschew multiple levels of complex redundancy and instead replace it with reliable and simple components include equipment maintenance and INSPECTION as part of our system. That might explain why Captain has never had any equipment failures.

N

Its called manufactures defects... happens all the time

 

[Nemrod]

Its called manufactures defects... happens all the time

Not really, it does not happen "all the time" which is the point. As well, you can inspect your equipment for manufactures defects and the majority of failures are not manufacture defects but incurred damage.

N

 

[Nemrod]

That is like saying a Brand New Corvette will not break down. Mine did on the way home from the Dealer. Shtuff happens.

That is why some of us buy Honda and Toyota, hell will freeze over before I will buy a vehicle from Guberment Motors. You guys just need to upgrade your equipment perhaps.

Guberment Motors business vision = building crappy cars that people do not want to buy that Obama tells them to produce to pay for UAW retirement benefits they don't deserve but get because they bought and paid for Obama.

N