Refillable filter cartridges

[Peter69_56]

I have both P21 and MCH6 stainless filters. Both off ebay and appear to work fine. I double filter anyway thus no issues via my fills. I find it amusing that people scare monger to try and maintain market share. If you use reasonable MS and AC, its not an issue. People try and scare monger that its a dark secret and you need to pay $65 for a cartridge or you will die. The reality is that if you know the science you are fine. MS will remove 20% by volume of water and AC 7.5% oil absorbency. That's scientific fact. The rest is scare mongering. Designed by people with vested interest. I measure my filters on a regular basis. Thus ensuring that they don't break through. People who use the 1 filter a month logic are fraught with danger, what number of fills did they use during this month, 1 or 10,000. That sucks. On a weight basis soon as you reach max weight the filter is dead.

 

[ti325v]

Not to make to fine a point of it Peter...GENERALLY m.s. is good for about 22.7% of mass not VOLUME as you said, before it is saturated...If you are pumping to 20% it is nearly certain you are pumping elevated levels of water into your system. The only way to know for sure about the batch you have in hand is to bake 100 grams at 500*F for 2-3 hours, and see if it looses any weight. If you are assuming the stiff out of the can in good for 20% you may be surprised sooner then you think.
Take that same 100G and then leave it out in open air for a day or teo and weight it again...ONLY then will you know for sure, anything else is an assumption.
M.S. should be changed when you last tower is hitting about 15% R.H. at pressure. If you are not stacked up with at least 1 large tower and a moisture eye, you will pop right over into introducing far too much water into your tanks VERY quickly
If you are COUNTING on the 7.5% % of A.C. and do not over size your beds, you are taking chances as well. There are a huge number of different molecules that the A.C. has to adsorb, and it is selective as is the M.S. As it gets saturated, it will release some and take up others. I have played around with all of this pretty extensively and am by no means an expert, but I oversize my M.S. by at least 30%. It costs near nothing even out here in the back of beyond, in a commercial setting. I am no where near there knowledge wise, and you still have a bit to learn, do not cut it so close.

Many commercial filters are 30 % A.C. which is actually about 20% oversize for the amount of M.S. in the filter..could be a lot of reasons for this but I suspect good one is the maker wants to be sure they get the oils out.

 

[Peter69_56]

1. I double filter and to date the second filter has picked up virtually 0 weight, thus no breakthrough to date. Should it breakthrough the second filter will pick it up anyway and I will see this in the results.

2. AC has a much longer filter life than the MS as most compressors are quite healthy and so little oil gets through anyway. By prediction the AC is no where near end of life when the MS is finished, thus I don't see AC being a problem unless the compressor has a major fault and pumping significant oil. In any regard, as I said previously I double filter, thus any breakthough is picked up in the second filter, and will show there.

Whilst I appreciate your concern, I did think it through before using weight. I still think weight is a better method than the suggested ambient temp and air volume which is advised by the manufacturer. That assumes quite a lot, and also has the risk of MS quality that you suggest as well.

 

[ti325v]

Hello Peter...
Do not want to enter into the great debate with you, and you are double filtering which covers your butt. I post this for those that know a little less..and possibly to give you some idea in what may be some faults in your logic..I am sure you are aware that M.S, is made with a binder material. It is not a pure chemical. Ths can easily result in different uptake of moisture, this stands for A.C. as well, though it is pure carbon, pore size, and contamination can all enter this issue of mass when saturated. The ONLY way to know is to bake the A.C. dry, expose it to air, till saturated, and then and ONLY then will you know for certain its moisture capacity compare weights before and after.
To be pedantic, unless the compressor is running massively hot, in general it will not produce enough micro particles of oil to ever be a problem, in properly operating seperator, they drop out of the air stream..cool air into the separator is good. I 100% absolutely agree temp and pumped volume are for beginners...and those that do not care to think too much. I do not and never have advocated those methods. I trust science and a scale accurate to .01 gram and sample 100 c.c.s at a time with each filter change. Going in and coming out, takes 5 minutes. No guess work involved. And still I way oversize my a.c. compared to what is proven I need. Its the crap in the oil that's gonna get ya, not a bit of water. And maybe the CO from that really hot compressor, I even run MO2 in my electric compressor.

 

[Peter69_56]

Hello Peter...
Do not want to enter into the great debate with you, and you are double filtering which covers your butt. I post this for those that know a little less..and possibly to give you some idea in what may be some faults in your logic..I am sure you are aware that M.S, is made with a binder material. It is not a pure chemical. Ths can easily result in different uptake of moisture, this stands for A.C. as well, though it is pure carbon, pore size, and contamination can all enter this issue of mass when saturated. The ONLY way to know is to bake the A.C. dry, expose it to air, till saturated, and then and ONLY then will you know for certain its moisture capacity compare weights before and after.
To be pedantic, unless the compressor is running massively hot, in general it will not produce enough micro particles of oil to ever be a problem, in properly operating seperator, they drop out of the air stream..cool air into the separator is good. I 100% absolutely agree temp and pumped volume are for beginners...and those that do not care to think too much. I do not and never have advocated those methods. I trust science and a scale accurate to .01 gram and sample 100 c.c.s at a time with each filter change. Going in and coming out, takes 5 minutes. No guess work involved. And still I way oversize my a.c. compared to what is proven I need. Its the crap in the oil that's gonna get ya, not a bit of water. And maybe the CO from that really hot compressor, I even run MO2 in my electric compressor.

Yes I agree with your thoughts. I only use synthetic genuine bauer oil. Having been burnt with crap Chinese compressor and supposed "synthetic" (which actually was mineral oil). Crap filter assembly. I am somewhat cautious. Given I now have a reputable brand I am somewhat less concerned.

My logic was arse covering in relation to dual filtering. Any leakage shows up in increased weight in the second filter. To date this has not happened. It was also interesting that using a volume method and also weight method, at the end of filter life by weight lined up close to air throughput volume as well. Whilst not an accurate method (per your comments), it seems to be reasonably valid. I take your point regarding quality of MS and AC. I am sure the chinese material is somewhat suspect compared to quality product from other sources.

 

[pommiediver]

hi,

i have purchased a refillable p21 filter and refill kits from Aqua-air in durban two months ago, really well made filter ,works perfectly , running it in my mariner 11. a worthwhile purchase.

rgds
p