travelling with backup

[slingshot]

In the past, there have been a few threads on travelling with dive gear in the "tanks and gear" section and in the "travel"section on the board. Haven't seen much of late. I am (was?) planning to take my bailout bottle (pony + SP Mk2+/R380) on a trip to Hawaii, but the airline (ATA) says "no scuba tanks" even if flying with valves off. Thus, some questions for y'all:

1. Do the airlines really pull your bag off a flight if they detect a valveless tank in your suitcase? No hearsay, only direct experience please. Does size matter (okay, let's keep our focus here) meaning spareAir okay, 80 cu foot bottle no way?

2. Has anyone tried shipping their bottles and meeting up with the brown van in their vacation destination?

"Why travel with a tank?" is no doubt running through someone's mind, but I haven't found much by way of pony rental's in Maui, I don't dive doubles, and generally prefer to dive with some redundancy.

Maybe if I stick a flower in the bottle neck and call it a vase?

 

[DORSETBOY]

Not exactly the answer you are looking for I know... but I've bought a "spare air" bottle when travelling for the same reason as yourself using a pony. The advantage is that they are far smaller than a pony but admittedly dont hold as much air.

 

[redacted]

Scuba tanks are not banned (by gov action) & I doubt if ATA has gone off on their own to ban them. I've traveled with my pony (valve removed) a number of time recently. including ATA, with no problem. You may have just run into someone who didn't have the company answer, but thought they did.

 

[slingshot]

Thanks for the input Dorsetboy and Awap. My wife has a spare Air specifically for travel, and we debate the merits of pony vs spare air enough not to revisit that old debate here. Seems less likely to get noticed, for certain.

I don't think there is any federal mandate prohibiting de-valved tanks on flights, but ATA operates under a "Contract of Carriage" document which essentially lays out its contract with its passengers. Rule 190 states that while some gear e.g. fins and regulators are okay if "appropriately packaged", "tanks are not accepted under any conditions."

If I try to sneak my tank aboard, I'll post the results (if allowed to do so by my court appointed attorney).

 

[Snowbear]

-but Alaska Airlines allows empty (defined as less than 40psi) scuba tanks in luggage or as air freight. I tell them up front what I have and have had no problems.

 

[Birdman]

My brother just had his 20 cu ft pony bottle confiscated from his dive bag by airport security folk who were supposedly operating under a national agency acronym about 3 hrs ago. They paged him after he deposited his luggage at the ticket counter. He is headed to my place and we are then headed out of the country to do a live-aboard. Another brother works for Frontier and says this is supposedly their new policy. I am still going to try to bring my 20 cu ft cylinder with me, and spot my brother a 13 cu ft cylinder I use for argon. I am hoping he was just unlucky...

 

[DandyDon]

I pack my 19 cu ft pony in my luggae, fully drained, on every trip now, but when I went to TSA site, I further searched until I got to this page...

http://www.tsa.gov/public/interapp/editorial/editorial_1190.xml

Which includes: "Dive tanks or any compressed gas cylinders are prohibited from carry-on and checked luggage."

TSA's toll-free number is 866-289-9673. Hope you can get the bottle back.

Otherwise, I hate to read that you want to use an Argon bottle as a Pony. Opens possibilities for confusion. One drag of Argon at depth can lead to be trouble.

don

 

[Birdman]

Dandydon -- thanks much for the info. No need to worry about the argon comment. I just didn't go so far as to say that in actuality I will only spot my brother a 13 cu. ft. cylinder that I use for argon after I carefully remove all traces of the argon sticker, remove the valve, and flush out the cylinder with air at my favorite local dive shop, which was the plan. Thanks for catching that.

 

[Doc Intrepid]

Thanks, Don, for the link. I emailed an inquiry to TSA and will post if I receive any reply. Awap, it appears the rules have changed and that you are mistaken!

Regretably rules such as this one are often written by someone who is not a diver, nor conversant with various options available. Not always, but sometimes. We'll see what sort of explanation is provided by TSA.

Meanwhile, pending some decision to revisit their ruling, it would appear that packing pony bottles in one's checked luggage is not an option. It is not wise to try in the hopes that the screeners will 'simply overlook' the tank in your suitcase. While it certainly may happen, it is doubtful...and if not you will be in the airport either with your bottle confiscated or with it in your hand trying to find a place to stash it before going through security on your way to your vacation. Neither option is very appealing.

At this point you have a number of other options:

1. Dive far more conservatively, plan carefully, and hope you don't get stuck with an inadequate buddy (if traveling single) and a rental tank with rust inside it or some other equipment failure.

2. Ship gear you'd like to the dive destination ahead of time, addressed to your host dive shop. Pre-arranged this should go smoothly, but nothing in life is guaranteed.

3. If your planned profiles essentially involve numerous deep dives, say on wrecks between 90' and 110', you could always sling mount another aluminum 80 like a stage tank. It's an awkward 'bailout bottle'. Breath it first, as a stage, and save backgas for unforeseen difficulties.

4. Same idea, different configuration. Something like this:
http://www.aquaexplorers.com/double_bands.htm


Then again, you could always trust the federal government to see the way, the truth, and the light and to reverse their ruling against (empty) compressed gas scuba cylinders in checked baggage!


Naaaah....

 

[DandyDon]

Spoke with an agent who said that the rules have always been the same with tanks. I asked her for a Supv. She contacted one, and still claimed that the rules have been that way all along...?

I've carried mine on 4 trips now, and - I think I'll continue. I'll be prepared:

(a) To remove valve, if that'll make them happy;

(b) Take it to my vehicle and leave it, if they insist; or

(c) To loose a tank. It could happen.

Really, I guess I could get arrested under the Act, but this seems very doubtful.

1. Dive far more conservatively, plan carefully, and hope you don't get stuck with an inadequate buddy (if traveling single) and a rental tank with rust inside it or some other equipment failure

Yeah, but - equipment can fail, and some of the boat-pick buddies I've had have been doozies. Few I'd trust with me life.

2. Ship gear you'd like to the dive destination ahead of time, addressed to your host dive shop. Pre-arranged this should go smoothly, but nothing in life is guaranteed.

For international locations, I think it'd be cheaper to buy new tanks and throw them away - as silly as that sounds. Might sell it there, but not for much.

3. If your planned profiles essentially involve numerous deep dives, say on wrecks between 90' and 110', you could always sling mount another aluminum 80 like a stage tank. It's an awkward 'bailout bottle'. Breath it first, as a stage, and save backgas for unforeseen difficulties.

Yes, they often do, but those are stateside, so I might ship the pony ahead there. Slinging another 80 is a bit much for me, I think, and boats often object to how many 80s they can carry. I've seen it.

4. Same idea, different configuration. Something like this:
http://www.aquaexplorers.com/double_bands.htm

Looks interesting, but the extra 80s on a boat thing again.

For boats that will allow extra 80s, this looks really interesting. I've read it pretty closely, but I'm not clear. Will they fit my Oceanic Probe BC, or will I need a new BC?

You'd need to alternate breathing off tanks, to avoid being unbalanced as one empties, huh?

Man, all I want is a bail-out bottle, and they screw it all up. For the record, I would not want to settle for a Spare Air, but then - those look covered by this prohibition, too...?!

Thanks for the discussion!! don