White Balance discussion

[Doc Harry]

I started this thread because of question that developed on another thread regarding green pictures and white balance. The initial question was how to avoid getting green photos. Most of the advice was to use manual white balance.

I searched the photo files of many of the posters who recommended manual white balance and their photos were........ green. No better than the photos I shoot with auto white balance.

I tried using manual white balance when I puchased my first underwater camera (a Sea & Sea DX8000). I bought a photo white card and corrected white balance manually at depth every time I shot a photo. I used manual exposure, too, and shot a lot of photos that really sucked. They were all still green, had very little contrast and were washed out, no matter what exposures I tried. And they were impossible to fix using Adobe Photoshop. And I'm pretty good at using Photoshop CS2.

Just for background information, I have been an avid top-side photographer for about 34 years. I usually shot color slide film using a light meter and manual exposures. (I had many cameras including Rollei, Leica and Canon.) I switched to digital 3 years ago with my Sea & Sea DX8000.

So then I switched back to auto white balance and manual exposure for underwater shots. The photos were still green but the color was easily corrected in Photoshop, especially once I discovered the Mandrake Process.

So my question is this: Why do people recommend manual white balance?

The photos are still green with manual white balance and they are impossible to fix using programs such as Photoshop. I must not get it. Help.

Here is the other thread:
http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/tips-techniques/212079-green-pictures.html

 

[pakman]

I find some P&S's don't MWB very well... Personally, I would rather buy a P&S that does RAW and then adjust the WB in photoshop.

But if your camera can do a decent job of WB'ing, it does help. For an example, I dug up some old pics that I took with my Fuji F30 in the greenish waters of Hong Kong. This camera doesn't do RAW but allows MWB'ing.

First pic was taken with the F30 set to AWB.

2nd pic was shot after setting MWB on the F30.

No color post-processing was done, just resized and slight contrast adjustment in photoshop.

**however, these shots were taken in shallow waters where the colors are still there. If it's deep, no matter how well your camera WB's, you might just get all blue or green as the reds just aren't there...

 

[ryanpublic]

I have a Cannon S5IS and just so you know I'm no professional photographer but I'm trying to learn. This thread caught my eye because I've been playing with this recently.

Sometimes when I try to set my White Balance Manually it doesn't work right and I have to try again. When it works I get good results. But when it doesn't its a little anoying. There are times when I just leave the WB on Auto but so far only in shallow water with plenty of ambient light.

 

[jarhed]

Here's my thoughts on the subject,

The only time i use manual wb is when I'm shooting filters (like magic filters), Otherwise I find that although I can get nice color in the subjects, the water color can take on a "muddy" look which I dislike.

For good color in photos, the only 2 ways I know is to use filters or strobes. each come with advantages and limitations.

I also find that I tend not to like what photoshop does to background colors when the RAW wb is useed, I like to color correct using the curves tool most of the time.

So, while I shoot full manual exposure most of the time, the only time I use manual wb is when I have my Magic Filters on.

Take care,
John

 

[Doc Harry]

Thanks for the info.

Pakman, I NEVER get photos like yours when I use manual WB. Maybe it's my camera? Maybe there's a big difference between cameras in regards to manual WB?

Jarhead, I've never tried filters, don't know if I could fit them to my Sea & Sea. I prefer to use a strobe if the water is clear enough.

I think I'm going to stick with auto WB with my Sea & Sea, but I will explore manual WB if and when I change cameras. Perhaps the usefulness of manual WB is camera specific.

 

[hammerhead man]

DOC HARRY, I am curious to know what is the Mandrake process??? I have photoshop elements 4.0 and use their color hue option to change the color from green water to blue water.

Regards,

Bill

 

[AndyT]

Not the DOC, but here's the action plus a detailed descriptipon as to how it works.

Adjusting Photos in Photoshop 7.0

 

[diver 85]

to th OP, can you post some of your pics here.............if you look @ mine, most were shot in manuel WB but I found shooting a white slate etc didn't work(either), so I shoot a light colored piece of coral or the (sometimes)white sandy bottom-- or I bracket & use Canon's UW setting.....................

 

[AbyssalPlains]

Many of us tend to think that the closer we set the wb for underwater ambient light, the better the images will be. However, that's how you get those nasty cyan or green photos. I recently tried the opposite - I set my wb manually to the WARMER end of the spectrum, at 4500 K. As a result, the camera perceives the blue water as really blue instead of a blueish white, which is what happens the closer you set the wb to the actual surrounding color temperature. The end result was that the background water in those pictures came out a very warm, saturated and intense blue, almost a little too blue, but no hint of green. In the meantime I adjusted the wb for wide angle a little toward a little cooler colors, about 5000K, and that seems to work well, too. However, I only used these settings recently on a California trip and the water looks very green in those pictures, which is what I wanted because the water was really green on those dives. But again, the camera yielded a nice full saturated green, not that washed-out cyan crappy looking green. On the other hand, if you are using strobes for macro, where you have virtually no water background, it is recommended to set the wb to the value of your strobe. This has worked great in my experience.

 

[scubapatton]

I learned some tricks when using my Canon Powershot S230. First of all, when setting the white balance, remember that the distance used to set the white balance, is the same distance that the photo should be shot at. I found the MWB worked VERY well for me at macro shots and close shots but was less obvious on more distant shots. If you REALLY want to see the difference it can make, take a shot of a vibrant colored fish - eg a Garibaldi (bright orange).