Living and Dying and Diving

[Quero]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

The discussion below was split off from a thread in Accidents and Incidents in response to a diver death. As a generalized discussion, it is not germane to the specific incident in question and therefore now has its own dedicated thread.

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[bayliner]

As divers we know that we are responsible for our own dive, but there are times that things happen. But,may God bless the diver and the family tonight. But on the other side of the coin when my time is up , I hope I'm diving and my family understands and forgives me for diving that day.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

But on the other side of the coin when my time is up , I hope I'm diving and my family understands and forgives me for diving that day.

I keep seeing this sentiment expressed in various ways ... or it's corollary ... "well, at least he died doing something he loved".

I've only once, in all my dives, been in a position where I felt I might not make it out of this dive alive. I can assure you I wasn't loving diving at the time ... although once the crisis was over I quickly recovered the love.

I have, on two occasions, been with family members of people who died while diving. They don't understand. They only want an answer to the question "why" ... and in most diving accidents that information is not ever going to be available.

I love diving more than just about anything I've ever done ... but I don't want to die while diving, because that would mean that I died while I was still in relatively good health, with some years of active life still to look forward to ... and in a manner that was, more likely than not, due to an error in judgement on my part ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[diverrex]

I keep seeing this sentiment expressed in various ways ... or it's corollary ... "well, at least he died doing something he loved".

I've only once, in all my dives, been in a position where I felt I might not make it out of this dive alive. I can assure you I wasn't loving diving at the time ... although once the crisis was over I quickly recovered the love.

I have, on two occasions, been with family members of people who died while diving. They don't understand. They only want an answer to the question "why" ... and in most diving accidents that information is not ever going to be available.

I love diving more than just about anything I've ever done ... but I don't want to die while diving, because that would mean that I died while I was still in relatively good health, with some years of active life still to look forward to ... and in a manner that was, more likely than not, due to an error in judgement on my part ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

While I also understand the sentiment behind "dying while diving as something you loved doing" I also think it's a strange thought. The people on the boat or shore will not have a good day. Your buddy or possibly crew may wonder what they could have done better to try to save you. You may not be found. All kind of problems with dying while diving. Much better to go peacefully while you sleep after a very long life, well past the time you eventually have quit diving.

 

[boulderjohn]

While I also understand the sentiment behind "dying while diving as somthing you loved doing" I also think it's a strange thought. The people on the boat or shore will not have a good day. Your buddy or possibly crew may wonder what they could have done better to try to save you. You may not be found. All kind of problems with dying while diving. Much better to go peacefully while you sleep after a very long life, well past the time you eventually have guit diving.

I have heard people argue that suicide (or any death, really) while diving would be beautiful because it is dying while doing something you love. I think it might be true if you suffered a sudden death for coronary reasons, but I think it would otherwise be about the worst way you can die.

If you look at suicide statistics, you will find that many more women than men attempt suicide, but many more men succeed. That is because men tend to choose the sudden death of a gunshot, and women are more likely to choose a less messy (and thus longer) means of death. That extra time is the difference--the body's instinctive drive to survive has a chance to override the suicide impulse.

I would think that the last moments of your air running out would be about as unpleasant as I can imagine. Remember that the extreme torture of waterboarding is so terrifying because it imitates the feeling of drowning. I don't think of waterboarding as dying doing something that I loved, and I expect that is how I would feel in the last minutes of a scuba death.

 

[mstevens]

If you look at suicide statistics, you will find that many more women than men attempt suicide, but many more men succeed. That is because men tend to choose the sudden death of a gunshot, and women are more likely to choose a less messy (and thus longer) means of death. That extra time is the difference--the body's instinctive drive to survive has a chance to override the suicide impulse.

I do look at these statistics. There are several reasons for the sex difference other than gunshot vs. other methods. The suicide behaviors of men tend to be more violent in general than those of women and therefore more lethal, even when firearm methods are left out.

Another issue is the frequent (I'd say "constant") misidentification as suicide attempt various forms of dangerous behavior that was not intended as suicidal.

I've spoken with LOTS of survivors of failed suicide attempts of various forms that "should have worked", from well-thought-out self-poisoning to shotgun wound to the head. Not one of them described any aspect of the process as in any way pleasant. This does include attempted drowning.

Victims of drowning and hypothermia tend to look peaceful once dead. I think that fools people into thinking these are peaceful ways to go.

 

[nimoh]

I think Bob makes a valid point, although IMHO the original intent of bayliner's post was not in regards to suicide, but rather a subscription to the belief that the end of one's life is predestined, meaning that you don't have a choice to live beyond that day, and scuba diving would be a romantic way to go.

 

[DandyDon]

I think Bob makes a valid point, although IMHO the original intent of bayliner's post was not in regards to suicide, but rather a subscription to the belief that the end of one's life is predestined, meaning that you don't have a choice to live beyond that day, and scuba diving would be a romantic way to go.

This is getting way off, but very few really believe in destiny with regard to life and limb or they wouldn't look before walking into traffic or any other safety precautions.

 

[nimoh]

This is getting way off, but very few really believe in destiny with regard to life and limb or they wouldn't look before walking into traffic or any other safety precautions.

I agree way off, although I don't think that this belief precludes one's life from ending before that day, just not after. Perhaps we need a existentialism forum on SB

 

[Mike]

If I die doing something I love doing, I guarantee you I can think of a better one than diving.