How does PADI define a "dive"?

[ucfdiver]

instructors floating with students between training dives are in clear violation of PADI standards.

Not that it matters, clearly the agencies aren't doing anything to prohibit their actions.

 

[*dave*]

I have seen instructors who will do a 20 minute dive in OW class, then have the students float on the surface for a 10 to 20 minute surface interval (whatever it takes to clear the computers being used) then decend to complete dive number "2".

Over 2 days of check out dives this means the students get "4" dives - but they only set up their equipment in the real world with wet suits, etc and/or change tanks twice and they only experience two entries and exits, effectively denying them half of that valuable segment of the OW course experience.

PADI and SSI need to discourage that. The 50 cu ft requirement would do that if PADI eliminated the "or" remains submerged 20 minutes criteria.

SSI defines a training dive as a minimum :15 duration and a minimum of 15'. Additionally, entry and exit with tank change is also required per standards.

There are times when a 50 cu ft requirement isn't realistic. During checkouts last weekend, I had a stick thin girl whose wetsuit was so sloppy a fit it didn't provide enough protection to keep her warm at the 42 degree temp at 30'. In this case, I addressed the issue by spending most time between 15' and 20', with short dips to 30'.

The result was a :32 BT, with her consuming less than 30 cu ft. She wouldn't have lasted long enough to consume 40 cu ft and the dive would have run in excess of :50.

 

[irishsquid]

...Tea-bagging sucks.

I've never heard that term before but the visual that goes with it seems very appropriate. At the risk of putting a bullseye on; individuals doing that, are going to be a disservice to their agency, potential danger to divers, and should be wrapped with string and squeezed out on a big spoon and discarded. I'm just OW certed and I would not want to be taken down on a dive to say; 95-100ft and the DM's dive log is padded with 15ft/15min dives. Heck, with the limited 2yrs. I have under my belt, I should be leading him/her. IMO

EDIT: Sorry folks, just realized this was for Cert Agencies. My apologies!

 

[bowtieman427]

Recently completed my OW each dive was 30-45min between 16-24ft and we exited the water each time. Took a little break got new tanks and went back in. Completed all skills in 3 dives and the 4 was the following day for fun. On the 4th dive we practiced navigation and bouancy some more which I am still weak at need a lot more practice. He called me when he is doing check out dive last week and I tagged along with and went out with another gentalmen who is practicing too. he told me he would call and keep me informed on upcomming chack out dives. I am very greatful he offers this. I think it is great to have the oppertunity to go out and practice and to have an instructor willing to let me do it. I have all my own equipment and my instructor is greatful for that too as he can just call and I can go not depending on him stuff.
Being new at this firmly believe practice is the key to getting better and one should take ever oppertunity even if less then ideal to do it.

 

[philmayer]

Not that it matters, clearly the agencies aren't doing anything to prohibit their actions.

Have you reported these instructors to PADI? Then how do you know PADI isn't doing anything? PADI works very hard to retrain instructors who aren't followinfg standards and will readily suspend an instructor for violating standards.

Every complaint filed with PADI about an instructor is investigated.

I know that if one of the instructors at my LDS wasn't following standards, he wouldn't be teaching there any longer. Violating PADI standards risks all of the instructors at a given shop.

 

[RetMTFE]

Just one of the many reasons I've always been wary of people who can't open their mouth without mentioning how many "dives" they have.

 

[CompuDude]

On the swimming pool thing - I suppose technically it might be a dive but I suspect most agencies would say that it doesn't count because it's in a pool, not an open water / diving environment.

It's not an open water dive, it's confined water. It meets standards for confined water training dives, but utterly fails the "open water" dive requirements for certification.

I've seen lakes that certain blur the lines between confined water and open water, but that's a different topic...

 

[Doppler]

Would you call a 1h pool session with various exercises call a dive then? Max. 3,5m, with BCD off and on at the bottom, "rescue" another diver, etc?

NO on both counts.

A dive is conducted in open water not confined water... following the logic that would allow either of the examples cited a dive, we would have certified divers who have no experience outside the YCMA pool.

 

[disccop75]

It amazes me that there are so many card chasers out there. Newer divers may look to these pseudo experienced divers for guidance and creates a safety issue.

 

[Thalassamania]

PADI (and most agencies) have a definition that requires something like: gear setup, briefing, an entry into open water, a certain amount of time underwater, an exit, gear dis assembly, debrief and log. While agencies do not require that confined water "dives" be logged, many employers require that all pressure exposures be logged, openwater, confined water, chamber, etc. It supprises me that with all the liability stuff that's flying about that shops do not require their staff to log confined water pressure exposures. Our dive log form at the university have a column to indicate environment, and one of the choices is "P" for pool or other confined water (e.g. various test tanks, wave tank, tow tank, etc.).