Gauge backup or not?

[elan]

Hello,
I have just bought an Aeris Elite T3 for myself and one for my girlfriend who is just getting certified. I have been debating with myself about whether to get rid of my console and SPG or whether to keep the old setup as a backup in case of computer failure during a dive. I realize that one of the advantages of a hoseless air-integrated computer is less clutter but if you have a failure of either the computer or the transmitter it relegates you to aborting the dive. Whereas with a backup SPG and dive watch you could simply revert back to diving the tables and continue with the dive. I realize there is also the point that with a normal console you don’t have a backup either.
What do you do? Have you ever had a computer or xmitter failure?
Thanks for the opinions
Brian

look the backup SPG would only make sense if you keep track of your load with the tables and at any point of time you can tell where you stand nitrogen load wise and can sagely continue your dive with an SPG. Otherwise it does not really make sense. If your totally rely upon your computer you have to abort your dive when your computer dies and SPG will not help you much. Now is the case that computer looses the link with the transmitter. Many friends of mine dove those wireless computers and I have never seen them failing on them with proper maintenance. So I guess they are pretty reliable in that matter.

 

[Blackwood]

GUEFundiesDiver?

He's apparently upgraded to GUETech2Diver

 

[tridacna]

former IT consultant, I am somewhat loathe to rely on computers for anything!

C.

Also better not fly on a plane, get in a car or a dive boat that uses GPS. Dang those computers get in the way!

 

[Crowley]

Hehe this post if making me laugh now!!

I'm glad some people on here have a sense of humour. From now on I'm going to dive with three long pieces of string with knots tied every metre so I know my depth, and they will be attached to three different snorkellers at the surface, whilst I carry one digital watch with a calculator just in case I need to do some maths, one analogue watch just because and a dive computer. I will also carry three tanks with an assortment of different regulators just in case!

I never use GPS when I'm driving, mostly because I haven't owned a vehicle for 5 years, and also I am one of those lucky people who knows where they are going.

On the serious side, several plane crashes have indeed been attributed to computer failure...

I really need to get off my ass; think it's time for the pub!

Thanks guys,

C.

 

[RAWalker]

I get a laugh out of people that have added a SPG or stopped using a wireless because of having a problem with them.
I have to question how they know their SPG is accurate since it's well documented that on averarge the pressure reading of AI computers are far more accurate. SPG are considered good if within +- 150psi where computers are +-25 psi.
That is a huge difference but the dominant way that these devices fail is even more interesting. The SPG tends to continue to function although outside the +-150psi range. This becomes extremely hazardous. The computers on the other hand tend to be highly visible total failures of the computer, failures to sync with the transmitter or failure of the transmitter. In any of these cases the diver would be aware of the problem and could safely abort the dive. Then the question become how they handle subsequent dives. This becomes a problem if th diver can not recover previous dive data regardless of the tank pressure. A failed computer could put you on the sidelines for the rest of the day. For this reason many divers use a SPG and timer so in the even they can revert to tables. That's fine, it works, but so does a backup computer. Even a non AI backup has the ability to extend your dive times and to use it you only need a simple pressure gauge not a full SPG. (althought at this point having a full SPG has no drawbacks)
So my conclusion and the way I have set up my gear is with 2 wireless AI computers;

If I were to lose sync/pressure readings on both I'd abort my dive and check my transmitter (I keep a spare in my save a dive kit w/ extra batteries) If I can't resolve this at the surface I have a SPG in my reg bag and can still use the computers without the transmitter.

If 1 of my computers fails I can complete my dive on the other. Upon surfacing if I can resolve the problem and fix the computer failure great. I can continue to dive on the backup or I could take the data from the working computer convert it to a square/table profile add my SPG and continue diving with a redundant backup to the remaining computer.

 

[Nemrod]

If your instrument needs a backup then you need a new instrument. N

 

[RAWalker]

If your instrument needs a backup then you need a new instrument. N

Not necessarily:
Since we can't eliminate the posibility of a failure of an instrument no matter how advanced, simple and regardless of it's quality redundancy lowers the risk associated with failure by requiring a second failure at the same time.
Since scuba is all about breathing underwater while mitigating the risks involved in doing that at depth, having more accurate instruments and redundancy help to manage that risk by lowering the chances of your being caught with errored, inaccurate or a lack of data to judge those risks.

 

[Nemrod]

Not necessarily:
Since we can't eliminate the posibility of a failure of an instrument no matter how advanced, simple and regardless of it's quality redundancy lowers the risk associated with failure by requiring a second failure at the same time.
Since scuba is all about breathing underwater while mitigating the risks involved in doing that at depth, having more accurate instruments and redundancy help to manage that risk by lowering the chances of your being caught with errored, inaccurate or a lack of data to judge those risks.

It is a no deco dive, you do not need two tank pressure gauges for a single tank on a no deco plan. If the air integrated one is sufficiently unreliable that you feel the need to carry a mechanical spg as well then just get rid of the air integrated device which alone will save a failure point and reduce complexity. For years we had no spg, then we had one and now you guys carry two in case the electronic one quits working. Maybe carry three or four? What if you get a sprain in your neck and cannot look to the left D ring, maybe have two spgs on the right side also. Or, just have one brass and glass quality instrument and be done with it. If the added complexity needs to be justified with three pages of posts (and counting), it isn't justified--next.

N

 

[fnfalman]

It is a no deco dive, you do not need two tank pressure gauges for a single tank on a no deco plan. If the air integrated one is sufficiently unreliable that you feel the need to carry a mechanical spg as well then just get rid of the air integrated device which alone will save a failure point and reduce complexity. For years we had no spg, then we had one and now you guys carry two in case the electronic one quits working. Maybe carry three or four? What if you get a sprain in your neck and cannot look to the left D ring, maybe have two spgs on the right side also. Or, just have one brass and glass quality instrument and be done with it. If the added complexity needs to be justified with three pages of posts (and counting), it isn't justified--next.

N

Exactly!!!

If a diver were to have no faith in either air integrated computers or wireless air integrated computers, then don't bother spending money on them. What's the point of getting one and then add a gauge? Might as well go with a gauge and a non-air integrated computer and save the money.

If you have no faith in your equipment then you should have made a better selection of said equipment.

 

[RAWalker]

It is a no deco dive, you do not need two tank pressure gauges for a single tank on a no deco plan. If the air integrated one is sufficiently unreliable that you feel the need to carry a mechanical spg as well then just get rid of the air integrated device which alone will save a failure point and reduce complexity. For years we had no spg, then we had one and now you guys carry two in case the electronic one quits working. Maybe carry three or four? What if you get a sprain in your neck and cannot look to the left D ring, maybe have two spgs on the right side also. Or, just have one brass and glass quality instrument and be done with it. If the added complexity needs to be justified with three pages of posts (and counting), it isn't justified--next.

N

The point isn't the pressure data alone. As you said it's a no deco dive so aborting to the surface on a failure is fine. The reason for the redundancy is for the nitrogen tracking. Since computers track nitrogen load in real time and credit you for the time at less than the maximum depth even if you know the true max depth and time figures taking them back to the tables could show you in violation when you actually are not. For years you needed to be overly conservative with your multilevel dive profiles. For years the incidence of DCS was higher than what it is today. For years pilots also suffered from DCS but technology has helped our understanding and gives us the ability to increase our safety margins. That is if you keep up on what technology has to offer and how to deploy it instead of sticking your head in the sand and ignoring the improvements available. I'd say it's actually your resistance to these items that needs 3 pages of posts to justify. Just because you did ok with "old school" doesn't mean that's the best way to continue or for a new diver get started.