S Drill Etiquette

[aquaregia]

If you don't like that approach you can simply bean the SOB over the head and "wrassle" the reg from him and watch him bullet to the surface.

This is basically the only justification I've been able to come up with for the gladius I dive with.

 

[vladimir]

I'd say it's a great example of the disadvantages of one particular configuration...

...and why I no longer padlock my octopus while diving. Sometimes you can't lay your hand on the key when you need it.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I'd say it's a great example of the disadvantages of one particular configuration...

The configuration wasn't the problem ... the problem (one of them, anyway) was that the person who set it up didn't do it properly.

Any configuration can be misapplied ... saw a guy one time take a long hose under his arm and wrap it twice around his head. I doubt that'd have been very deployable ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Rainer]

Whatever you wear IS the configuration, not some ideal. The diver's gear in question was poorly configured.

The configuration wasn't the problem ... the problem (one of them, anyway) was that the person who set it up didn't do it properly.

Any configuration can be misapplied ... saw a guy one time take a long hose under his arm and wrap it twice around his head. I doubt that'd have been very deployable ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[DCBC]

Regardless of what you donate, if the secondary isn't working, you're going to be buddy breathing (at least in a team of two).

You presume too much; not all divers today know how to buddy breathe.

The central issue is simply one of whose need for gas is more crucial at the moment of the OOG. I contend it's the diver who is actually OOG. Getting him a 100% known working regulator is paramount. If my secondary turns out not to be working, fine, we'll handle that in turn (just as we would if your octo didn't work). Your method, however, would have the OOG diver waiting even longer (and you'd now be donating your primary to a *really* panicked diver). Best to avoid all this panic and give up the known working regulator from the start. There's a reason this method has been adopted by basically every technical diving agency in existence.

There was also a reason in the past why every training agency accepted the way that I teach to be the way that it should be taught and buddy breathing was a requirement. Now most divers are not trained in this manner. Don't be lecturing me "that the training agencies know best." They don't all agree.

If you're not comfortable without a regulator for a short while, you probably should find a new hobby.

I may be comfortable without a regulator longer than you, so don't be so condesending.

 

[DCBC]

I think that's something people should bear in mind. Good chance the OOG didn't happen in isolation so it may not be your only challenge.

With regard to primary Vs secondary donation: I think you make very valid points DCBC however for me, the part that I never liked about donating an ocotpus is that they tend to be somewhat poorly behaved in terms of position and I feel there is genuine risk in someone, whether donor or receiver fumbling in a stressful situation trying to find a backup somewhere. I'm pretty sure Lamont witnessed a fatality because of a diver that could not unloosen the donor's secondary (please correct me someone if I'm wrong).

I like donating primary and having my backup under my chin. For me, it really really feels right - I feel very secure in this solution, much more so than the octopus alternative. It has some drawbacks, sure, but not in an OOG situation as far as my limited experienced is concerned.

Cheers,
J

It certainly doesn't matter to me how anyone chooses to dive. If you're comfortable with what you do that's great. If we ever dive together, we will both know what to expect and will go over the drills before the dive. That's more important than if you donate the primary or secondary to me in an OOG emergency. If I'm OOG, I'll just be glad to get something. At the time, I'm sure you will feel this way as well.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Whatever you wear IS the configuration, not some ideal. The diver's gear in question was poorly configured.

Well ... DUH! Thank you Captain Obvious.

Of course, you KNEW that I was talking about a standard recreational rig vs a long-hose rig. We were, after all, talking about donating an octopus vs donating a primary. Either one, poorly configured, won't work very well. As I stated ... this particular case is a poor example to use in that discussion.

I'm not interested in arguing semantics or having some internet "expert" parse my words for me ... please waste someone else's time ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

You presume too much; not all divers today know how to buddy breathe.

Wayne, you're making some assumptions yourself ... like that you won't know the person you're sharing air with. If that's the case, you will be dealing with an unknown quantity ... and taking risks you haven't the knowledge to evaluate beforehand ... no matter what type of reg setup you're using.

We all have to use what we're comfortable with ... but I don't think that the circumstances you've described provide any advantage to handing off an octopus vs the breathing reg. You're going to be taking risks either way ... the only thing that matters is how well you're prepared to deal with them.

Bringing the buddy-breathing controversy into it is a non-sequitur ... if the OOA person doesn't know it, and the two of you need to do it, you're kinda screwed either way ... hose length is gonna be the least of your worries at that point.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Rainer]

You presume too much; not all divers today know how to buddy breathe.

If you only have one second stage for two divers, you have the rest of your life to learn how to buddy breathe in an OOG situation.

There was also a reason in the past why every training agency accepted the way that I teach to be the way that it should be taught and buddy breathing was a requirement. Now most divers are not trained in this manner. Don't be lecturing me "that the training agencies know best." They don't all agree.

Your "old school" ways are exactly that in many domains of diving today. Basically every technical diving agency has decided that getting an OOG diver a known working regulator is a priority over the mild inconvenience of being without one for a couple of seconds. If the procedure can work in the most stressful and urgent situations (deep, back of a cave, etc), then it's going to work just fine on an 80' reef with a little practice.

 

[Rainer]

Of course, you KNEW that I was talking about a standard recreational rig vs a long-hose rig.

I did until you made your silly post 103. I'm not sure you know what configuration means. That's ok.