Newly certified, but

[on_two_wheels]

"OW training is pretty basic. Diving with someone else that has a whopping 5 dives (and maybe vague training like your's) is NOT a good dive buddy yet"

Strongly disagree here. The best buddies can be the newest divers if they actually know what a dive buddy is and were trained to be one.

Disagree all you want and while your posts are HIGHLY respected by most (myself incl), you have to take into account the OP. He already acknowledged a lack of proper training for both himself and his training buddy. Perhaps YOUR newly certified divers are capable, many certified divers are not properly prepared. I certainly wasn't and it sounds like the two mentioned by OP weren't either. Until things like pre-dive checks, gear maintenance, gear set up, etc are consistently done well, a mentor is a GREAT idea.

I compare it to motorcycling. Take an MSF (motorcycle safety foundation) course and they'll teach you everything you need to know to ride. Does that mean you should take a passenger and hit the southern california freeways right away? Probably not.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

That is why I clarified it with "can be" and "if". 5 dives is plenty to reinforce good buddy skills if they were introduced from the beginning.

And as for California free ways. Was in SF and on exactly one. That was enough! I wouldn't take a tank on California freeways. Not counting the fact that they have a tendency at times to fall down!:shocked2:

 

[shakeybrainsurgeon]

No matter how good the training, the variety and challenges faced even by "recreational divers" make it impossible for many newly certified divers to feel comfortable on their first dives without an instructor. I trained and did many early dives in a quarry, where visibility and temps were low but entry was fairly easy. When I did my first ocean dives, I thought it would be a breeze (good visibility, no wet suit), but I hadn't reckoned with sea sickness, climbing up ladders in uneven seas, and the buouancy issues of salt water and the lack of a wet suit. I didn't "train" to have my mask knocked off by four foot wave as I was planning to descend. Of course, it is important to master basic skills, but issues like buoyancy and overall comfort in the water are a matter of experience. No course can train you for every environment and every possible snafu.

As I said many times in previous threads, there is no rule that says that once you have a C card, you no longer need help, experienced buddies or even hired DM and instructors on your first "non-training" dives (actually, official policy is that there are no non-training dives --- you learn something every time you go under), especially when diving in environments other than the one you trained in.

Take advanced courses, and at any potential dive site, inquire as to the availability and cost of professional dive buddies. If you feel you aren't ready to buddy up with an inexperienced diver, you aren't. It isn't fair to your buddies to look after your insecurities unless they are trained, equipped (and, in some cases, paid) to do so.

 

[dburg30]

But you sure should be able to have a friend join you on their bike and take a nice country road ride. More of an apple to apple comparison IMO. 2 newly certified divers should be able to do a no current 20-30' dive with no problems. Not saying they wouldnt make mistakes, but they should be able to dive and learn from those mistakes. Same way with the cycle riding scenario. Now, I'm not saying there couldnt be a deadly mistake made, but again, cars, motorcycles, airplanes, hunting, biking, anything could have deadly mistakes made by newly certified people

 

[shakeybrainsurgeon]

For some people, the bestowing of a C card endows a person with instant power, as when the Wizard hands a diploma to the scarecrow. It doesn't work that way. I agree, after a good course, a diver should be able to do a 20-30 ft dive in non current, high viz water. Unfortunately, a) such sites are not that common...non current sites, like quarries, often have near zero viz making navigation skills important; 2) not many dive boats specialize in shallow, no current sites and the current conditions might change, and shallow sites might have some degree of wave surge which can be harder to deal with than current (like diving a a washing machine); 3) the idea that shallower dives are safer and easier reflects a lack of experience, in that the pressure gradients are greatest in the first 33 feet, making buoyancy harder and things like ear barotrauma more likely. In fact, it often takes more effort and skill to safely maintain a depth of 15 feet that to maintain a depth of 80 feet.

Unless you dive in swimming pools or at EPCOT all the time, there are few dive sites that can guarantee you a 20 - 30 ft, no current, high viz "beginner" dive. If that's what you need, you need an experienced buddy.

 

[on_two_wheels]

But you sure should be able to have a friend join you on their bike and take a nice country road ride. NOPE!! Even a bit of gravel on the road can be fatal to someone not experienced and there's no training for how to handle a sliding motorcycle.

Now, I'm not saying there couldnt be a deadly mistake made, but again, cars, motorcycles, airplanes, hunting, biking, anything could have deadly mistakes made by newly certified people

My point exactly. Newly certified buddies may not recognize them as quickly or even before they happen as we hope an much more experienced diver might. An experienced diver may make mistakes, too. It's just a matter of increasing the safety odds, not guaranteeing them.

Jim....the most notorious freeways are in LA. If you were up north and hated the ONE fwy you were on, let me know when you visit. Better I drive you around.

 

[JamesBon92007]

I just completed my open water certification. I really question whether my skill level is sufficient to go into a dive situation. My training seemed rather inadequate. The following is my experience and self-evaluation of my skills. Skill testing was done in 18 foot of water.

Here's my 2 cents: you seem to be aware of your capabilities and your limitations. That's a lot, in my opinion. It sounds to me like you will do just fine--just stick to your limits and do more as you develop your experience.

As for regulators: Gosh, and gee whiz. I've not tried one of these new regs that cost zillions of dollars and can't even imagine what they can do that my old Sherwood Magnum can't do but I suspect it's not very much. My Sherwood is made of plastic but it's very durable plastic. I imagine there's a lot of crap around now. I still use my old AquaLung Calypso chrome-plated brass on occasion but it doesn't breathe all that easily. Durable as hell though. All I can say is try to try out many different regs (rent if you have to), get reviews and personal opinions (paying attention to how long they've had/used it). Also find out if the service manual is available online. I have a Dacor that I have not yet used in the ocean but they can be had cheap cause they no longer make parts for them. It seems like it is probably a good regulator though. I got an extra second stage and some other parts really cheap so it should last me a while (I do my own reg service). BTW when I took apart my wife's 28-year-old Sherwood that's spent many hundreds of hours in the ocean it looked brand new inside (first stage). OTOH she needs to pay more attention to rinsing her second stage. I personally would not hesitate to buy one of those used as long as the inside of the second stage looks good and the little air bubble thing on the first stage is working (small stream of bubbles--actually supposed to be there) Just make sure it's coming from the unusual-looking port . If the second stage leaks a little it can almost certainly be adjusted by removing the LP hose and turning the screw slots about 1/8 turn while holding in the purge button. If that doesn't do it then a new seat should.

And, like many others have said, get your weight right.