Dolphin and OMG Azimuth semi-closed , differences?

[nitrojunkie]

Dude, you never let the other half know what dive gear costs!

Accentuate the positive, "look at this LITTLE ccr, see how much more closet space we have since I got rid of all those big bulky EXPENSIVE doubles". She'll never believe that little breather costs anywhere near what it does>;-)

Just factor in all the costs... a lot of folks are recommending the Explorer as your Po2 Monitor, I don't know much about it (I dive a VR3), just make sure whatever you buy will be a compatible step to CCR and not yet another piece of kit that ultimately needs to be replaced.

I bet a careful analysis of total cost of ownership will be closer than what you think. Compare what will need to be spent to modify the dolphin to include Po2 status (Draeger P-valves included). The SCR training and experience will definately make for a solid transition, but I would wait it out.

I'll shut-up now. Besides I have to go convince the wife that those containers of Sorb really don't take up that much room in the closet...where the doubles used to be!

Doug

 

[Life-Is-Good-Diver]

Dude, you never let the other half know what dive gear costs!

Accentuate the positive, "look at this LITTLE ccr, see how much more closet space we have since I got rid of all those big bulky EXPENSIVE doubles". She'll never believe that little breather costs anywhere near what it does>;-)

Just factor in all the costs... a lot of folks are recommending the Explorer as your Po2 Monitor, I don't know much about it (I dive a VR3), just make sure whatever you buy will be a compatible step to CCR and not yet another piece of kit that ultimately needs to be replaced.

I bet a careful analysis of total cost of ownership will be closer than what you think. Compare what will need to be spent to modify the dolphin to include Po2 status (Draeger P-valves included). The SCR training and experience will definately make for a solid transition, but I would wait it out.

I'll shut-up now. Besides I have to go convince the wife that those containers of Sorb really don't take up that much room in the closet...where the doubles used to be!

Doug

Hey Mike, no problem, no reason to be quite, you have experiance in somthing i don't, so im listening to everyone's post

I know the Hs Explorer, i had one as my deco computer all ready, but in either case wether it's SCR or CCR, i will need either thast computer or the Vr-3, i thought if i can get into a SCR Dolphin for $2,300 with training included, with two tanks, that's half the out of pocket expnce right now for a CCR, with my OC gear, i accuried close to 10K in stuff over a 2 year period of time, i actualley had close to 20k in gear, i buy and try then sell alot of gear, but the expence was carried out over the past 2 years, with rebreather, the first inital cost is right out of pocket just for the unit, and training, so i thought start the road now with a SCR, buy the time i buy it, add the computer, training, and so on, id be over 3k where i wanted to budget for this in the begging, if i went to CCR i could easley see doubling that, which in another year i can see doing, seems alot of people start off using the Dolphin's, they are all over the place, unless i had the money for a CCR, it wouldnt be a factour then,see if i buy a unit for 5k, it now cost me 10k cause then i have the buy the wife somthing to lol, she actualley just got ALL very nice equipment for diving, top of the line for a women to use, so hopfully i can just replace those bulky doubles and slide a rebreather into there place the joke with the sorb is cute, lol, thanks for your input

 

[kiam11]

I dive a Dolphin and I'm going to go the CCR route just as soon as I can! I outfitted my Dolphin with two 19 cu. ft pony bottles and an AIR2 for bc inflation and bailout. The unit is easy to maintain and fun to dive up to about 125'. I'm not an authority, but if I were you I'd seriously consider the KISS unit. It's expandable and looks well put together. Also for money it'll take you further into RB diving then the Dolphin. If all the advice you've gotten so far still does not sway you to consider CCR diving, and you still want a Dolphin, I'm looking to sell mine for a fair price. PM, email or post me.

 

[Terence of Arabia]

I have been diving with the Azimuth for about 6 months now and have been satisfied with the overall construction of the rig. I turn down the adjustable dosing group to 1.4lpm(about as low as you can go with metering device) and dive with 70-80% nitrox in bottom tank. I put air in the top tank and use that for diluent and bailout. I manually add rich mix as necessary to maintain ppO2 set-point. This set-up allows me to get approx 6-7 hours of diving off 1 tank, vice the typical 2hrs using BOTH tanks(saving 1/2 of 1 tank for bailout). There are many different ways to skin the cat in terms of modifications, this is just what I did. So, yes, it can be done wit the Azimuth. In my opinion though, modifying any rebreather is NOT recommended unless you are very knowledgable with rebreathers and aware of the associated risk involved. After all is said and done, I would have gone the KISS route.

I think that I may have missunderstood your posting when you say that you use the top tank as a dilutant. As I understand the plumbing, switching in the top cylinder does not switch out the bottom one which means that your dilutant is a mixture of the contents of your top and bottom cylinder. The only way, I think to change this is to physically turn off the bottom/ primary cylinder whilst feeding your dilutant. Am I wrong??
Terry

 

[hornetplt]

I think that I may have missunderstood your posting when you say that you use the top tank as a dilutant. As I understand the plumbing, switching in the top cylinder does not switch out the bottom one which means that your dilutant is a mixture of the contents of your top and bottom cylinder. The only way, I think to change this is to physically turn off the bottom/ primary cylinder whilst feeding your dilutant. Am I wrong??
Terry

Terry,
Your are correct.....I have my bottom tank turned off until I reach my initial working depth. Once I reach that depth, I turn on the bottom tank and secure the switch on the bypass block which will now allow for use of the bottom tank ONLY. If ppO2 starts to run a bit high, which does happen on occasion (when drifting or not working much), I flip the switch on the block again and get a mixture of top and bottom tank. I hope my answer helps!

 

[Life-Is-Good-Diver]

That's another serious danger in CCR diving called Hyperspousia.
Gotta be very carefull with that, can cause serious pain.
And, unfortunately, much like Hypercapnia, there can be no warning,
nor is there a reliable way to gauge it yet.

LOL, omg you guy's are got me!! I thought you and diver Mike were serious, i said dam!!, Not another thing that can kill me that i cant even pronounce!!! HEhehee, i have to say this is a very hard decison, even though im getting certifed on the Azi and Dolphin here in 2 week's, that sport Kiss is a nice unit, i never thought this was going to so hard of a descion bewteen SCR and CCR, but im holding back now from buying anything until i know what i want, to confused right now !! This is not easy

 

[Dive Bear]

I dive my Drager with one 13 cf bottle to inflate my drysuit and BC, a 19 cf bottle for bailout only and 27cf nitrox bottle for the loop. That 13 cf bottle is not enough for bailout unless it is full, on your second or third dive of the day, it will NOT be full. Back when I only had the 13 cf, I managed to run it dry on my third dive. I was only in 45 fsw and I was diving with a buddy and instructor, but it was still a bad feeling.

I use Tiger mounts for the 13 cf and 19 cf bottles. The Tiger mounts were a snap to install and they work very well. That silly bag that comes with the Drager sucks.

PS - I like diving my Drager, but I'm still planning on going CCR in about a year. If I had not found a good deal on a used Drager, I would have just kept saving for a CCR.

 

[caveseeker7]

I dive my Drager with one 13 cf bottle to inflate my drysuit and BC, a 19 cf bottle for bailout only and 27cf nitrox bottle for the loop.

13 cf plus 19 cf comes to 32 cf gas supply for bc/drysuit/bailout. FLTEK, the Azimuth has a 2nd 27 cf tank which should, considering you probably don't use drysuits much in FL, suffice for bc and bailout.

I just realized that no one really adressed you initial question about the differences between the Dolphin and Azi.

Have you read Dave Sutton's Azimuth teardown ?
He points out many of the differences between the two.
Unless you plan to travel by plane the Azi probably deserves the nod, though they are harder to find used.

 

[Life-Is-Good-Diver]

13 cf plus 19 cf comes to 32 cf gas supply for bc/drysuit/bailout. FLTEK, the Azimuth has a 2nd 27 cf tank which should, considering you probably don't use drysuits much in FL, suffice for bc and bailout.

I just realized that no one really adressed you initial question about the differences between the Dolphin and Azi.

Have you read Dave Sutton's Azimuth teardown ?
He points out many of the differences between the two.
Unless you plan to travel by plane the Azi probably deserves the nod, though they are harder to find used.

Hi Stephan, i have read every word on Dave Suttin's web page, i like it alot, you have been VERY helpfull, and i appreciate it

Im going to dive the two next weekend, can't wait, then i''ll make a descion on which one im going to buy.

Thank's again!

 

[Life-Is-Good-Diver]

I dive my Drager with one 13 cf bottle to inflate my drysuit and BC, a 19 cf bottle for bailout only and 27cf nitrox bottle for the loop. That 13 cf bottle is not enough for bailout unless it is full, on your second or third dive of the day, it will NOT be full. Back when I only had the 13 cf, I managed to run it dry on my third dive. I was only in 45 fsw and I was diving with a buddy and instructor, but it was still a bad feeling.

I use Tiger mounts for the 13 cf and 19 cf bottles. The Tiger mounts were a snap to install and they work very well. That silly bag that comes with the Drager sucks.

PS - I like diving my Drager, but I'm still planning on going CCR in about a year. If I had not found a good deal on a used Drager, I would have just kept saving for a CCR.

Thanks divebear, i do plan on diving this winter with a semi-dry suit i just bought, so that should elimate the need for air for a dry suit, but if im not happy with the semi-dry, im buying a DUI drysuit here shortley also, in a few month's, unless the semi dry really does suck, then i'll just sell it and go dry, ive dove dry for the past 2 year's and love it.

I really like the Azi, thats a well built, well planed eng wise SCR from what i read on the web, i'll dive it and the Drager next weekend in my class, so i will really get to see it and dive it, can't wait.

That will probley be the only reason i go Drager as well if i do, simply cause you can find them all over for less then 2k, in great shape, i don't see any Aziumth's come up, nor do i see any CCR as i been watching everywhere, but when i do goto CCR, i plan to go new, so for now, the SCR route was a starting point for me, and hopfully i can get back what i spent on the unit when i do sell it going into CCR.

Thank's for the info, i will consider all those options as well, as for the Azi, i don;t plan on using the other tank for filling the bc, simply cause i want to get 4 dive's out of the day between the two tank's, then go fill them.

I'll probley use my 13' pony i have now for bail out, switch that over to just for filling the bc, and buy a 19' pony for OC bail out, on either on.