Can we take things from the ocean?

[Johnoly]

....Can we take things from the ocean?...

Y E S !!!

Take all the L I O N F I S H you can stuff in your bags!!
Totally legal and highly encouraged by FWC officers, no license needed !!

 

[agilis]

Whale shark and Manta Ray?

Black Cap Basslet and Spotted Drum. I'm amazed by your brilliant humor. How ever did you think of so clever a question? I'm sure the folks at the plant relish your comments.

 

[scubadada]

It's a somewhat controversial topic, but since you seem to be implying malice in a behavior that is extremely common in my area (NYC wreck diving), let me politely present a counter argument. Our wrecks are rapidly dissolving into piles of rust on the ocean floor. So some people feel that removing and conserving artifacts allows these historic wrecks to speak to many more people than if they were to just remain buried in the sand or hidden under tons of collapsing steel.

I personally usually just take pictures, but the few pieces that I have mean a lot to me, and are displayed where non-divers can hear their story.

Casualties of warfare have different considerations, as do wrecks that are owned by someone. I'm not an expert on that type of law.

This rationalization for chopping out the portholes of a wreck has been forwarded many times. Sorry, I don't buy personal possession of these artifacts as a public service. If they were in a shipwreck museum, that may be a different story. Seems like this may be a NY, NJ thing, perhaps reflecting the philosophy of the local wreck divers.

 

[The Chairman]

I hunt for fish and lobster. I collect shark teeth off of Venice Beach, Fl. I've collected a few shells here and there. I've been very careful to obey all laws when I do, whether they are national, state, or Captain's rules. It's up to you and your ethics about whether you will collect or not. Don't make the mistake of thinking that people who don't collect somehow have higher ethics. They're just different.

 

[SlugLife]

It depends on a number of factors:

• Are you causing any meaningful harm to the environment? For example, I doubt anyone would care about another dead lion-fish, but something like coral takes a very, very, very long time to grow.
  
• Are there any local laws? Are you within their jurisdiction either for (a) collecting the item or (b) possessing the item?
• What is the item?
• Do the dive-boat operators or anyone near you have a problem with it?
• Would taking or interfering with the item, take away from future divers?

Personally, I'm not so anal about "take-nothing from the ocean," or forest, etc so long as you're not causing any meaningful harm. However, you also have to know what does or doesn't cause meaningful harm.

 

[Moerae]

It depends on a number of factors: so long as you're not causing any meaningful harm. However, you also have to know what does or doesn't cause meaningful harm.

One really big caveat here.

The question isn't "If I do x am I causing harm?"

The question is "If thousands of divers do x are they causing harm?"

No single snowflake blames itself for the avalanche.

 

[MaxBottomtime]

This rationalization for chopping out the portholes of a wreck has been forwarded many times. Sorry, I don't buy personal possession of these artifacts as a public service. If they were in a shipwreck museum, that may be a different story. Seems like this may be a NY, NJ thing, perhaps reflecting the philosophy of the local wreck divers.

Many individual collectors display their finds at various shows annually. This not only increases awareness about the local wrecks and their history but also brings in new divers.

 

[100days-a-year]

At some point you will have develop your own ethos. While asking here is a part of that you'll probably want to discuss it with dive buddies and research local customs and laws.

I have taken fossils and cool empty shells.

Being a veteran, the son of two veterans and the descendant of countless veterans I don't like the idea of disturbing war graves.
Any unintentionally sunk warship that had loss of life is a war grave to me. Except to identify them or bring closure to relatives.

I will not take a shell if I'm not planning on eating the occupant.

I have spearfished and lobstered commercially and recreationally and have no problem with other people doing it legally.

I have no problem with people collecting fish, invertebrates or live rock for aquariums if done legally.

I do have a problem with other people trying to force their morals on me or others.

 

[The Chairman]

The question is "If thousands of divers do x are they causing harm?"

Yeah, that's not a very reasonable question. I doubt we have thousands of spearos. Even with as many as we have, compared to indiscriminate angling, we have no bycatch we're killing.

Night diving off of Saba years ago, I saw a meek nurse shark go after a tasty morsel under a coral head. Swooooosh, the shark's tail wipes out a barrel sponge that was at least 3 or 4 feet tall. Dayum. Then he really flicks that tail and I watched him flatten the entire spot. I was truly amazed to see a nurse shark act this sharky and then I heard the crunk and a bit of blood flushed through the shark's gills. As he backed out with his prize, I was horrified to see the coral head tilt, make another crunk sound and then roll to the bottom. I still shake my head at how much that 4 ft nurse shark wreaked in pursuit of their dinner. Shheeeshhh! That single shark eclipsed all of the damage I've witnessed from poor divers since I started diving.

In my estimation, divers have a much smaller impact on the environment than pollution or any commercial activity. There might be some localized damage and we should all do our best to prevent that. The Keys are a good example of that. Lots of diving and almost all of the damages are a function of septic tanks poisoning the entire reef system.

 

[OTF]

My 2psi:

Underwater hunting (spearfishing, lobstering, scalloping etc.) is GOOD if done sustainably and humanely. In fact, it's far better than "normal" commercial fishing methods which are quite destructive. And there's something that just seems more fair about doing it by hand. Kill your catch quickly regardless of whether you think it can "suffer" or not, follow the regulations, do not overharvest, don't take anything you don't plan to eat, don't take juveniles or big breeding females, do not take rare or threatened species, don't damage the habitat while you do it.

Pertaining to man-made artifacts and wreck stuff - I'm not going to get into a long ethical tirade, especially because my position on the matter is far from settled. But a few notes:

- Artifacts being recovered, then just left to collect dust in some random cabinet where nobody except one diver knows they exist is no good. So many things end up being thrown in dumpsters by family members when those divers pass away.
- Proper cataloging, preservation, and public display are important if artifacts are recovered.
- At the very least, tag every artifact you find with a label that says where and when it was found and what it is. This also makes collections cooler.
- 95% of the crap people bring up from wrecks they would pass right over at a flea market.