Question Apeks XTX200 vs Aqualung Legend Elite vs Other?

[Itsdavidyang]

@rsingler as the apparent brass , can you recommend what you would go with here, given my needs/preferences? Is it Scubapro? Which model? Something else?

 

[Divin'Papaw]

I own one Legend Elite and two Legend LX regs. All are DIN. I love them. They are real workhorses. One of my Legend LXs is 19 years old and the other is 16 years old. The Legend Elite is three years old. I’ve had them as deep as 180 feet, as well as on a lot of very cold water diving in the Great Lakes. I’ve never had a single issue with any of them. Combined I have over 750 dives on the Legends.

I used to own an Apeks ATX200 and just really did not care for it. I’ve since gotten rid of it.

ADDITION: As to the ACD, I really like the feature. It helps to eliminate the risk of water entry into the 1st stage when not charged. All of my Legend regs have it. The concerns and few reported issues with the ACD are with the Yoke version. All of mine are DIN and the DIN ACD does not have the same design issue as the Yoke. If you use yoke regs, you will want to make sure you get the newer model that has adjusted the design to prevent potential blockage of the flow of gas. If you are buying new, it should have the new design.

 

[rsingler]

what you would go with here, given my needs/preferences?

The question is pretty huge, and there are as many answers as brands. If you wade through the multiple threads from folks looking for reg suggestions, the list is all over the map.

What do we have for baseline data?
You're a spearo, and if I yield to stereotypes, that means you may be a little tough on your gear's exterior during a dive. It doesn't mean you mistreat it or don't care for it, but maybe a thin plastic case isn't your best choice. To me, that rules out the Aqualung Elite. For a diaphragm reg that will take a beating and not crack, think Deep6 Excursion or Scubapro Mk11/C370.

As always if you're not ready to plunk down $200-500 for tools and DIY, then what brands can you get serviced reliably? You can send out to Deep6 or Dive Gear Express or others. What are your local reliable options? Apeks, Aqualung and Scubapro all are common enough that if you find a good shop, you'll likely be okay. What's popular near you now? Talk to the shops.

The Legend first stage is a great regulator, notwithstanding the constraints of the second if it gets banged around. The ACD can be a nice feature for ease of cleanup, and the DIN version has no history of problems. Others disagree with having a "mechanism" in your gas flow path. With DIN, I have no concerns with the Aqualung design.

Again, as a spearo, gas delivery is critical for high exertion spurts at depth. While good tuning is 75% of it, the reg does play a role. That was a big piece of my suggestion for Deep6 Excursion or Scubapro C370. Apeks? Not so much, from my testing. But most every modern reg, Apeks included, will give you everything you need at depth if properly tuned. But then, Poseidon Jetstream and Xstream also have a great record for deep gas delivery.

Or you can mix and match. There's zero reason not to have your favorite first stage and a different brand second (maybe excepting your current Cyklon, due to Intermediate Pressure differences).

And we haven't even touched on pistons vs diaphragms for first stage.
And Florida salt water and tropical temps are hard on regs, verdigris corrosion-wise. But environmental seals may be a little delicate in the spearfishing environment.

Yah! Too many variables for a short post.
But a regularly occurring and important question.
I hope others will contribute their opinions...

 

[Mobulai]

And Florida salt water and tropical temps are hard on regs, verdigris corrosion-wise. But environmental seals may be a little delicate in the spearfishing environment.

thin plastic case isn't your best choice.

Would maybe something like a SPEC mk10 (actually not like, specifically) be a good „best of both worlds“ in this case?
I’m trying to avoid the bringing up mk25 here since you’ve pointed out the issue with the seal and how they tend to deteriorate.
An aftermarket/diy SPEC boot pr inner tubing and an mk10 would be relatively easy to come by and service and even if the SPEC cover breaks, it’s still a piston that can take some water, right? Or would I be missing something in my reasoning here?

Or you can mix and match.

Long live Franken-regs; my singular instance of an APEKS is the 1st, and it’s paired with Mares VR 2nd (had to check IP ranges to avoid kinks, luckily they were plug and play as they are in an overlapping range with only 0.1 bar not overlapping, but they are O2 clean so at 6-15m risk is pretty low - I think)

 

[Bloody Marvelous]

I can't speak about how often Apeks 2nd stages fail. I can only tell you that mine haven't.

I've seen people do lots of stupid things to their gear, and blaming the service technician for their own error. I saw a guy rant and rave that he couldn't get his first stage off the cylinder anymore after it had been for a service. He'd even been trying with a wrench, and had marred up his first stage in the process. The service technician simply pushed the purge button and unscrewed the DIN wheel by hand without any effort. Regulators come with a manual. Read it.

Some people here do seem to like to rant against Apeks for some reason, and will gladly use the current financial issues of Aqualung as a cudgel. Just because some gorilla doesn't know to stabilize the second stage barrel when unscrewing the hose, doesn't mean the gear is poorly designed.

I personally like Apeks. I think they make great products. They're reliable and durable, and for regulators, BCD's, masks, and fins they're reasonably priced. Their accessories can be comparatively expensive, like their lights, spools and reels, but what they put out is extremely well designed and a joy to use.

Apeks is a European brand, so their products are more expensive in the US. Sometimes prohibitively so. Maybe that's why people like to **** talk them. There are plenty other great manufacturers with great products out there as well. I'm a big fan of the Scubapro Mk19 with the G260 second stage. I also really like the Mares Abyss and the Atomic M1.

I'm a big fan of XDeep, though at the moment they don't have a regulator in their catalog. They had one, but was recalled due to one regulator turret failing, and they couldn't guarantee it was an issue only with that single regulator. So they stand behind their products.

I tend to stay away from brands like DiveRite, Tecline, and Dive Gear Express. Their gear may well be every bit as good, but it's gear on a budget, and I just get a "second choice" vibe from them. I'd much rather stick to well established brands.

 

[admikar]

I can't speak about how often Apeks 2nd stages fail. I can only tell you that mine haven't.

I've seen people do lots of stupid things to their gear, and blaming the service technician for their own error. I saw a guy rant and rave that he couldn't get his first stage off the cylinder anymore after it had been for a service. He'd even been trying with a wrench, and had marred up his first stage in the process. The service technician simply pushed the purge button and unscrewed the DIN wheel by hand without any effort. Regulators come with a manual. Read it.

Some people here do seem to like to rant against Apeks for some reason, and will gladly use the current financial issues of Aqualung as a cudgel. Just because some gorilla doesn't know to stabilize the second stage barrel when unscrewing the hose, doesn't mean the gear is poorly designed.

I personally like Apeks. I think they make great products. They're reliable and durable, and for regulators, BCD's, masks, and fins they're reasonably priced. Their accessories can be comparatively expensive, like their lights, spools and reels, but what they put out is extremely well designed and a joy to use.

Apeks is a European brand, so their products are more expensive in the US. Sometimes prohibitively so. Maybe that's why people like to **** talk them. There are plenty other great manufacturers with great products out there as well. I'm a big fan of the Scubapro Mk19 with the G260 second stage. I also really like the Mares Abyss and the Atomic M1.

I'm a big fan of XDeep, though at the moment they don't have a regulator in their catalog. They had one, but was recalled due to one regulator turret failing, and they couldn't guarantee it was an issue only with that single regulator. So they stand behind their products.

I tend to stay away from brands like DiveRite, Tecline, and Dive Gear Express. Their gear may well be every bit as good, but it's gear on a budget, and I just get a "second choice" vibe from them. I'd much rather stick to well established brands.

Disclaimer: all my regs are Apeks.
But that 2nd stage is a bad design. Every time I undo the hose I open the cap and take a look if barrel is straight.
Reason I went with Apeks is that it was the only available service tech course. I prefer not to drive 150 km to drop them off and then do the same again to pick them up (being outside of EU and service shop in EU makes postal service a no go).
That being said, I never had issues with regs delivering all the gas I need (although I tune them quite hot).

For the OP, being in USA, if I were in your position I would go with Deep6.

 

[rsingler]

@Bloody Marvelous , that's a fair critique of my rant. I don't personally have anything against Apeks, and maybe my financial comment was a cheap shot.
But @admikar is right. Gear should work reliably. And the barrel stabilizers of Apeks (and HOG) are flimsy. Why should a non-technician diver have to remove a faceplate and check that the lever is horizontal after a simple hose change? That's ridiculous.

The square broach for the barrel in Scubapro and Atomic regs never lets the barrel go out of alignment. That's proper design. And while I'm at it, diaphragms shouldn't leak, period. Another design flaw.

 

[NW Dive Dawg]

Can't really comment on the XTX200.......but will say my 20 year old ATX200 in DIN with the both venturi assist lever and the cracking pressure adjustment knob is the cats pajamas and I'll never give it up. At depth or under an increase working load I can put that reg in "feed me Seymour" mode and the flow is amazing... Just need to remember to "detune" at my SS or it'll cut free once I hit the surface...

 

[grantmac]

The Cyklon is a heck of a good reg, what isn't it doing for you?

 

[Itsdavidyang]

The Cyklon is a heck of a good reg, what isn't it doing for you?

It’s overall fine but it does have the slight annoyance that it only has a single HP port. And it’s getting harder to service