Cold Water Drysuits??? What should I be looking for?

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adamp69

Contributor
Messages
120
Reaction score
7
Location
carbonear, newfoundland
# of dives
100 - 199
hey. I'm looking to puchase my first drysuit. I live in newfoundland, canada. and this is where 90% of my diving happens. I'm currently diving a wetsuit, and i dont normally have any problems with getting cold, altho the other day, at about 85 feet, the bottom temp. dropped dramatically, and my extremities got a little cold. Alot of the ppl i dive with are diving with laminate drysuits, some whites fusion, some Bare CD4.

what i'm wondering, is what is the best suit out there for cold water?

which suits have the best warmth to weight ratio? or which require less lead?

Neoprene or laminate?

And Which drysuit gives you the best value for your money?

Thanks people. Love this site!
 
Have a good look at the new whites fusion one......tough to beat for value, price, flexibility and ability to customize the undergarment for any temperature of water.
 
Hey, I dive out in ontario all year round. Huge fan of ice diving.

I believe a drysuit is to keep you dry, what keeps you warm is what you wear underneath.

That being said, lots of people prefer one or the other. I like tri-lam because they are light weight, dry fast, don't need as much ballast and i can use em in a wide variety temps since we can hit high 80s in the summer and 30s in the winter.

---------- Post Merged at 09:36 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:31 PM ----------

I hear DUI makes some really nice suits. has anyone tried the CF200.

DUI is nice.....very expensive and i just don't believe the quality of suit is there anymore.

I loved my whites catalyst but when it did finally leak, the material they use to make doesn't seem to like regular glues adhere to it.

Waterproof is a brand I would love to dive, but a bit out of my price range.

I got a smokin deal on a Bare HD tech, its a bit heavier tri-lam but pretty bulletproof.

you can always start with something used. One of the biggest thing is fit.....if it doesn't fit properly then you are gonna fight with it and hate it.
 
what i'm wondering, is what is the best suit out there for cold water?
Laminates are more popular and those have no real thermal value, it all comes from the garments worn beneath. Laminate suits are very durable and repairable. Seals and with a lesser frequency the zipper are perishable items that are likely to need replacement over time. The suit and garment can be expensive but used items are out there.

Neoprene suits are usually worn with limited garments, often just a wicking layer and maybe a light thermal layer. The neoprene provides a good measure of insulation. Envision your wetsuit with zero water infiltration. Very atractive deals can be found. However beware of used suits. Being neoprene the material can fail in some odd ways including difficult to repair leaks. With limited garments and some stretch it can often have a fit that approaches a wet suit. Laminate suits are non stretch so they are over sized for mobility. The fabric puckers up on descent. Also being neoprene they will remain wet on surface and the cooling can be significant on a surface interval. There are exceptions but most regard them as nice starter suits.

which suits have the best warmth to weight ratio? or which require less lead?

Neoprene suits are pigs to sink so laminate wins here. It can still take some real weight to sink a laminate suit when wearing something like a 400gm Thinsulate garment. Steel cylinders were made for dry suits!


Neoprene or laminate?
Eventually laminate for most.

And Which drysuit gives you the best value for your money?
It's a toss up. you can buy a number of neoprene suits for the price of a single premium laminate suit and the garment budget will be smaller too.

A good reference post.

Pete
 
i have no intention of buying a used suit. and i have no problem spending extra money on a better product, if there is such a thing...lol
 
I like to have drysuit for being dry. You should not rely on it for warmth. Those suits which are warm (neoprene 4 and 7) mils have also very negative downside - they lose buoyancy and thermal property with depth just as regular wetsuits. If you rely on your undergarment for warmth and use a shell suit you di not have that downside.
IMHO in your area you shoul look at least at 400 g thinsulate undies. Later uou can also add a heated vest. For me the problem im cold water do not start with my body being cold but with my lips numbing.
 
I have CF200.

Pro:
-very tough, almost indestrutable, if you need to make contact to environment a lot (kneeling on bottom), this is the suit for you
-form fitting cut is possible because the material is stretchy
- crushed neoprene really doesn't compress like "compressed" neorprene in other brand.

Con:
-not very flexible, not recommended thick undergarment like 400g thinsulate if you want to be able to reach your valves
-very heavy when wet, so not a good travel suit
-very long dry time

Overall, it is a good suit, just keep the Cons in mind.
 
I've been diving dry for close to 20 years now.

Neoprene

Neoprene dry suits have their place. If you get one that is fairly snug and wear only a wicking layer underneath, you'll have a very streamlined suit that swims very well - much like a wets suit and with similar weight requirements. Neoprene seals tend to be very durable and last just about forever, plus they provide insulation at the neck and wrists where blood flows close to the surface, keeping you a lot warmer. The neoprene fabric contains the insulation and a 5mm or 7mm drysuit is a lot warmer than a 7mm wet suit, and is comparable to a tri-laminate drysuit with intermediate weight underwear, even at depth. They also do not suffer from the condensation problems that plague a trilam as the insulated "outer" prevents that. A snug suit is an option as the material stretches, so fit is less critical. The downside of this approach is that it limits your really cold water options as you can't stuff much underwear in it. O'neil used to make an absolutely superb 5/7mm neoprene drysuit and it sold new for around 500.00 and Atlan sold a 7mm suit that was also great for a similar price. If you go to a baggier fit in a neoprene suit, you'll have room for very cold water undergarments, but you now have a baggy suit with more drag that requires a lot of weight. It will be extremely warm and would be my choice for diving the north pole, but not so much for general diving. Other neoprene downsides are that they dry slowly, are fairly heavy, especially when wet, and pinhole leaks can be hard to find and take longer to repair.

Trilam

A trilam will be very draggy unless it fits you very well or is custom cut. And, in that case, it also becomes a one trick pony in terms of underwear. You can get a suit that fits well with heavy underwear, but then it will be overly baggy with excessive wrinkling and increased drag. Or you can get a suit that fits well with lightweight underwear, but then it will restrict your movements with heavy underwear. The downsides of trilams are the condensation issue in cold water, limited durability, potentially high cost (especially from DUI, and DUI is mostly riding on name and past reputation now, they are nothing special in terms of quality) and the lack of stretch in the material (and the resulting fit/drag issues). They are however fast drying, lightweight, and both easy and fast to repair.

Crushed or compressed neoprene

The two are not the same, but they are the middle ground between neoprene and trilam suits. They offer some inherent insulation, avoid the condensation problem and tend to be very durable. But they are heavier, and while they have some limited stretch, they have to have the baggy fit of a trilam. They are slow drying ad slower to repair.

Bilam suits.

Where trilam uses a nylon/butyl rubber/nylon "tri-laminate" material, most bilam suits use a nylon fabric with a urethane coating on the inside. They have all the basic traits of of a trilam with the exception that they are less expensive, less durable, and much less longer lasting as the bilam fabric tends to separate. The exception here is the Whites Fusion, which uses a bilaminate bladder, but one that does not appear to be urethane and is very durable.

Whites Fusion

As noted, it has a bilam inner bladder, but it's covered with an outer shell available in a few different styles from an all lycra sport skin to a lycra and neoprene tech skin to an all neoprene bullet skin. The combination of an inner "bag", which is fairly roomy, and a stretchy outer layer that provides both protection to the bladder and serves as a compression garment, allows a stock suit size to provide a near custom fit. If you get a size that allows heavy undergarments, it will also be very streamlined when worn with just a wicking layer, and in both cases it is almost as streamlined as a wet suit and swims closer to a neoprene drysuit or even a wet suit than a trilam drysuit as bubble management is easier than with a trilam. They are also very durable and easy to repair. The outer cover dries slowly if you have something other than the sport skin, but they are also comparatively lightweight and pack in a small volume. They are in my opinion, the ideal drysuit.

zipper styles

Three major options:

1) across the back. Inexpensive, streamlined (as it does not need a telescoping torso), durable, but somewhat restrictive and hard to get in and out of on your own (you ca do it, but it requires skill and technique).

2) diagonal front zip. Self entry and exit, more expensive, usually requires a telescoping torso and adds a bit more drag, and requires a cover to prevent waist belts from eating it.

3) across the chest front zip. Mostly found on Whites and Andy's drysuits. Self entry without the need for a telescoping torso - sort of a pop top approach to dry suit entry. Also requires an over zipper to prevent damage from straps.

Valves:

They only come in Si Tech and Apeks flavors. I prefer Si Tech but both are fine. Inflators are on the chest and exhaust valves can be mounted on the upper arm or on the cuff. There are pros and cons based on how you'll use the suit, but most people will be better served with a valve on the upper arm.
 

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