federal officials asking for public imput on Manatee protection

[ReefGuy]

Another tax on boaters or whatever, you're correct that it won't cure stupidity, carelessness, rudeness, or recklessness. It will, however, make the above accountable for their actions, and more likely to be caught.

Arrrrrrrgh a license is just another tax on boaters, it will not cure stupidity, carelessness, rudeness or recklessness. I go out on the water to relax and enjoy getting away from it all. The last thing I need is more stops. Yes they routinely stop boaters for no reason, no it isn't pleasant, yes it ruins the experience of being on the water relaxing. All they have to do is catch the ones breaking the law and fine the hell out of them ($500 and up, not $50), word will get around. It's not hard to find the morons driving boats and we don't need to license every boater in the state to get them.

 

[reefsavers.org]

Ironically, it was the red tide mass mortalities that pointed a glaring finger at the inaccuracies of the aerial manatee surveys used for so long. They didn't discern a drop in manatee populations the year(s) the red tide outbreak occurred.

I noticed you spend a great deal of time looking through enviromental issues yet you claim to be neutral to where you stand on them. I wonder if you could be convinced to become more envolved for the right side of the issues and make good use of your abilitys?Im not trying to offend you so please do not take this the wrong way, but you sound like the guy who told me he was going to send some money to help clean the reefs and after 6 months I gave up waiting on the check. The whole idea of having an ability and the knowledge and being able to make a difference with that ability and not using it upsets me. I know you are a Teacher and If you teach your students the same I question your methods.
As a teacher you have an oppurtunity to bestow respect for the enviroment to your students and if you teach them to recognise and to view those issues but don't act on them you are not accomplishing anything. You'll end up with robots and that's basically whats wrong now. I know you have published and commented on issues, I respect that and you should be commended. Its my opinion you should involve yourself more and even if your opinion is not the same as mine it will still draw attention to the facts and that alone is the best place to start isnt it? thank you for sharing your thoughts on this subject and if you ever wish to get more involved let me know please. We could use someone with your abilitys.

 

[adder70]

...we have MORE than enough laws protecting the manatee...

...Florida needs to license boaters. Every single one...

...More laws? Don't need them. We just need to put the teeth of enforcement behind the existing ones.

Umm, how exactly do you license boaters? With a LAW maybe? Basically, make the law abiding boaters pay a tax to support the enforcement of laws on people who break the boating laws? What about taxing neighborhoods pedestrians since most burglaries are commited by people who walk into homes in a neighborhood? Most are also minority youth (compared to overall population). Perhaps license minority juveniles? - Oh, yes, also, shoplifting must be controlled. Therefore, we must license all shoppers!

Notice noone talks about fees for accessing waterways at all. Why not an access fee along navigable waterways. If you travel a mile, you pass a checkpoint and pay a small fee per person, regardless of vehicle. yes this includes swimmers. After all, swimmers can bring a convenient plastic bag holding, say, edibles, and then deposit that bag directly in the water, blocking the intestine and killing the bird that eats the dead turtle that already choked on the same bag!

The point was made earlier. You can't legislate responsibility. You have to teach people to care. Unfortunately, many areas are being inundated by new arrivals who don't even know the hazards to the local environment, much less have a vested interest in saving the place where they grew up. At the risk of being labelled anti-immigrant, let me mention also that low-income (I mean REALLY low) nations in central and south America send us many people EVERY DAY that only want to find dinner for tonight, and they think nothing of dumping a huge bucket of used oil out in their yard! Imagine what they do on "public" land! They haven't been taught to care about the environment, they have only been taught that life is tough and that you have to fight just to survive. Ecology doesn't even register compared to feeding your family, especially when only 40% of the population speaks your language and you need a job with no documentation.

 

[reefsavers.org]

Umm, how exactly do you license boaters? With a LAW maybe? Basically, make the law abiding boaters pay a tax to support the enforcement of laws on people who break the boating laws? What about taxing neighborhoods pedestrians since most burglaries are commited by people who walk into homes in a neighborhood? Most are also minority youth (compared to overall population). Perhaps license minority juveniles? - Oh, yes, also, shoplifting must be controlled. Therefore, we must license all shoppers!

Notice noone talks about fees for accessing waterways at all. Why not an access fee along navigable waterways. If you travel a mile, you pass a checkpoint and pay a small fee per person, regardless of vehicle. yes this includes swimmers. After all, swimmers can bring a convenient plastic bag holding, say, edibles, and then deposit that bag directly in the water, blocking the intestine and killing the bird that eats the dead turtle that already choked on the same bag!

The point was made earlier. You can't legislate responsibility. You have to teach people to care. Unfortunately, many areas are being inundated by new arrivals who don't even know the hazards to the local environment, much less have a vested interest in saving the place where they grew up. At the risk of being labelled anti-immigrant, let me mention also that low-income (I mean REALLY low) nations in central and south America send us many people EVERY DAY that only want to find dinner for tonight, and they think nothing of dumping a huge bucket of used oil out in their yard! Imagine what they do on "public" land! They haven't been taught to care about the environment, they have only been taught that life is tough and that you have to fight just to survive. Ecology doesn't even register compared to feeding your family, especially when only 40% of the population speaks your language and you need a job with no documentation.

thats the problem they think that if they buy a boat they know how to run it. When I was a kid we used to watch million dollar yachts run aground in Mosquito lagoon. We d bet on how long it would take for them to get free. Usually we never won because we had to go home before they could get off the bar. I relly like the response " well i slowed down but the manatee didnt move so I hit him on accident". Yeh it was a accident alright a accident that you were so stupid and could'nt turn the wheel.
It was also a accident that my foot kicked all the teeth out of your mouth too!~

oh by the way what good is it going to do to liscense boaters if they arent going to obey the rules. Its like saying lets write a ticket but lets not make them pay the fine if they dont want to. You were right that other guy was way wrong!

 

[archman]

I noticed you spend a great deal of time looking through enviromental issues yet you claim to be neutral to where you stand on them.[

That would imply that one cannot be neutral on an issue and still be knowledgable on it. As for spending a great deal of time studying such issues, it's my job and my interest.

I wonder if you could be convinced to become more envolved for the right side of the issues and make good use of your abilitys?Im not trying to offend you so please do not take this the wrong way, but you sound like the guy who told me he was going to send some money to help clean the reefs and after 6 months I gave up waiting on the check. The whole idea of having an ability and the knowledge and being able to make a difference with that ability and not using it upsets me.

I am not this hypothetical person who pledged money for a cause and then reneged, although I do from time to time inquire from various government and NGO's certain details regarding their operations. I am also not sure what you mean by "right side", is that political right or more-accurate right? The latter is far more complicated to ascertain in most environmental issues... everyones' always at least a little bit correct. Much as pro/con environmental groups find this difficult to believe, scientists don't pick sides, they pick data. We support wherever the data takes us. Often the data changes.

I know you are a Teacher and If you teach your students the same I question your methods.

My teaching protocols do not usually involve environmental issues. Somebody else teaches those-type classes. I merely touch on them as they relate to habitat structure within certain ecologies, or animal behavior.

As a teacher you have an oppurtunity to bestow respect for the enviroment to your students and if you teach them to recognise and to view those issues but don't act on them you are not accomplishing anything. You'll end up with robots and that's basically whats wrong now.

A teacher's job is not to convince a student, but to inform a student and have them make up their own minds based on the evidence given to them. Most of my undergraduates are scientist track or schoolteacher track, and I do not want to impart them with any improper notions regarding the scientific method, or the role of science in environmental policy.

Its my opinion you should involve yourself more and even if your opinion is not the same as mine it will still draw attention to the facts and that alone is the best place to start isnt it? thank you for sharing your thoughts on this subject and if you ever wish to get more involved let me know please. We could use someone with your abilitys.

Thank you, but I'm busy enough at present. I do wetlands restoration locally, assist with government coral reef monitoring, do my own reef monitoring with my field classes, rehabilitate marine life, and occasionally work on my primary research, deep sea ecology. Caribbean ecosystems are more of a hobby for me. Better than collecting stamps.

 

[reefsavers.org]

Another tax on boaters or whatever, you're correct that it won't cure stupidity, carelessness, rudeness, or recklessness. It will, however, make the above accountable for their actions, and more likely to be caught.

The truth is that theres not enough enforcment and theres too many areas that are patroled by officers that are more content with catching a fisherman with a few too many shrimp. I was out one night fishing and my running light went out I immediately went to shore on a island and was repairing it when a sheriffs deputy stopped in the channel and asked me to come out to him because his boat couldnt come as shallow as mine. I obliged and when I did he wrote me a ticket for no running light after I told him I was repairing it. Then as he was writing the ticket a boat went by going 50+ mph thru a manatee zone and I told him I would wait if he wanted to go get him he said "na Im not worried about him theres no manatees around here right now!"
Well kiss my *** because by the time he said that one surfaced 25 feet away from us.
anyhow I got a ticket the manatee was safe and the sheriff lost his paper work so when I went to court the judge threw it out. By the way the sheriff left me in distress in the middle of the channel with no running light. Thats a felony! It is illegal to leave a boat in distress. about 25 minutes later the same boat came flying back thru again only this time I had something to throw...

 

[DennisS]

I've been boating in Florida for about 30 years, the enforcement sounds typical, we sure don't need more of the nitpicking BS.

I've had a marine patrol officer sit on the beach for two hours waiting for me to come in. When I came in, she wouldn't let me take of my gear, she did a careful check around my BP/wing, like I'm going to hide a spiny lobster there. I was told by someone on the beach she was there for 2 hours with her binoculars. I was the only diver in the water. She told me my flag pole should be straight up and down not at an angle, but she would let it go. I have a 6 foot pole. with a boat size flag, mounted through a boat fender painted international orange, with a 10 lb weigth on the bottom.

Yeah lets license boaters and get more of these folks out there.

 

[CBulla]

Just a note: Licensing boaters is easy. They all have to register their boats, thus for renewal of registration or registering they will have to present this license. Since FWC or Marine Patrol or both are at every boat ramp in this county, checking licensing is not tough. I watch enforcement of both DUI, lack of fishing licenses, illegal catchess, etc., are all enforced.

This also generates the revenue to get more enforcement on the water and with the increase of active marine enforcement training will have to go up to ensure that those who are enforcing the laws are adequately trained.

Pipe dream.. yeah.. possibly. I'm still working on the FWSC to

 

[ReefGuy]

Sorry, typo. I meant more laws protecting manatees, we don't need.

Yes, obviously you will need a law to license boaters.

I suppose you're against licensing automobile drivers as well, because that's unfair as well...

Umm, how exactly do you license boaters? With a LAW maybe?

 

[reefsavers.org]

Actually the state did a research on this one, they were considering adding a boaters endorsment to your liscense and you would have to take a exam just like motorcycle and CDL. I think its a good idea however, knowing how legislature is in this state once they made it mandatory for you to have a liscense to operate a vessel of any size or caliber they would pass a bill making it mandatory to have insurance and to provide that proof. We all know that insurance rates in florida are rediculous but can you imagine what that nightmare would be like. Say good bye to boating fishing diving etc.
I think people should just slow down take more initiative to be a safer boater and last but not least I think if everyone slows down they will be safer and so will the manatees. I want to also add that people need to consider that since the hurricane theres allot more obsticles in the water and going fast thru any waterway isnt very smart right now.Its not just the manatees Ive had people run my dive flag over and never slow down. Theres a time and place for everything and too many people dont have consideration for others and they are the problem. I think the state should set up a 1-800 number to call and report id numbers of people violating the zones.
Knowing they can be charged will help slow them down. I also think if there is a greater number of manatees in some areas they should monitor it closer and if the area has no manatees consistantly then those areas could be adjusted as a trial period and if there are any fatalitys there then they should be adjusted accordingly.
Im not sure if thats a fesible optin but its fair to all sides. I also think there should be some sort of recreation area where boaters are protected from manatees so people can enjoy their sport. There are ways to close off areas so manatees dont venture in and interfere with activitys. Pro boating groups could raise money to establish areas.
the state would probably cooperate in order to satisfy the demand. there are alternatives and solutions and lowering the status is not one of them. at least not yet...