First Post! First BC purchase, a mistake?

[aquaoren]

Hm. I think charging a reasonable amount for your services is reasonable. Trying to tack on extra profit by charging *un*reasonable amounts for drugs or parts is not cool.

I do computer work, including occasional jobs where I will, say, build a system for a small company or individual. I will charge an appropriate amount of money for my time and expertise.. but if I'm building a computer or installing a new video card, I won't mark up the prices for parts an unreasonable amount. I'm already getting paid for my services.

No offence but this is a poor comparisation.
Let me ask you how much do you have to spent to get your business started? What equipment do you need and how cost intensive is it? Lets not forget that you do mark up the parts as well
Let me tell you about my cost before I'm able to open the door at all and earn a cent.
I need an x-ray machine and machines to develope those x-rays, chemicals for developement and discarding those chemicals as hazardous waste(!!!). It would be roughly $50000. I need an Operation room that is equiped with a surgical table, lights, anaesthesia machine and of course instruments to perform the surgery (~$50000-100000)...... Should I continue or would it be enough saying that before I can earn a cent I have to put in around $500000-1000000 to open the doors of my business.
So, after knowing all this lets go back to the expression:"reasonable mark up" and discuss whether what you consider a reasonable mark up in your profession would still be reasonable in mine Would I be able to sustain a business and continue employing people with the mark up you'd consider reasonable, when you don't have the same daily cost as I would?

 

[aquaoren]

So, in other words, a mechanic's garage should actually make its money *selling parts* whereas the mechanic himself should make money mechanic-ing.

Hm.

Yep. Not only selling parts but providing the tools and premises to perform the mechanics job

 

[aquaoren]

Yeah, I think he was perfectly willing to pay for your services...at least I am...I love Vets!

But at the same time, I do save a bunch of cash specifically on the medications at 1-800-PetMeds and the like, as compared to what I pay buying those meds from my Vet directly.

Oh no...I can see it now LDS vs Local Vets vs LeisurePro vs 1-800-PetMeds vs BP/W...

Thank's for the compliment
I know it will sound a little like the "support your LDS" rant as many are asking where will you get your air when the LDS closes. Most will answer: I'll get me my own compressor.
On the same point: When your dog will start having vomiting and diarrhea or will brake it's leg, will you call 1-800-PetMeds for the bloodwork, meds and an orthopedic surgery as well? I don't assume anyone wants to buy all the needed equipment to treat their pets at home even if they would know what they are doing and would have the money to buy all the equipment? Isn't it great that there is a business just around the corner that is able to offer me these services immediatly without having to wait?
The mark up is not money making. The proceeds from it support the whole clinic so when you need it, we can offer you: Radiology, Surgery, Laboratory, etc, etc...... it's really not pushing pills to make a $

 

[wtrdoc52]

Completely off topic but as a Veterinarian I had to respond
After spending more than 6 years at the university and having collected loans to pay for my education, I think that I'm entitled to be paid for my professional services and knowledge. In order for the pet to become better, it has to be medicated. Why do you expect me to pay for the meds of your pet?

Oh lord, I opened Pandora's Box!<l> I had just returned from the vet when writing the first post and the LDS situation reminded me of my beef with vets. When I take my dog to the vet, I expect to pay he/she for their time and expertise. If I need a med for the pup, I'd like the vet to write me a prescription and leave the purchase of the med up to me. If the vet is selling the med at a competitive price, I'll buy it from them. Otherwise, I'll buy it somewhere else. Heartgard is a case in point. A vet must provide you with a prescription to purchase this product. I can purchase this product online from Dr. Foster's for almost 50% less than what the local vet wants for this product. However, I have to provide Dr. Foster's with a prescription from my vet to purchase this product. Would you provide a client with a prescription for this product, if they chose to purchase the product elsewhere? Seems to me there is an inherent conflict of interest when vets also sell the meds. The vet I went to this week suggested I put my older dog on Rimadyl. I declined because I've looked at numerous articles and testimonials on the internet dealing with the possible side effects of this product, including death. Yet the vet never mentioned the side effects to me and I have other friends who have had the same experience. The Senior Dog website dedicates an entire website to this subject and provides testimony from folks who have lost dogs, but were never warned about the potential side effects and/or the need for monitoring via blood work. Okay, so I'm going off on another tangent.

I work as an industrial water treatment chemist selling "expertise" and chemicals to powerplants. These folks know that my TSP is the same as another companies TSP. So, they want to know why mine is higher priced than the other guys. Well, I've got 26 years worth of experience (expertise) in power plant chemistry and the other guy might only have 5 years. So, I have to "sell" the prospective client on the value of my "experience" and/or separate out the cost for my "expertise" from the cost of the chemical.

This is where I jumped in on the LDS question. A good LDS shop sells expertise and equipment. If you go to the LDS and use his time and expertise to learn about BC's, and then purchase the BC online, aren't you/we doing to him what you as a vet don't want done to you?

Like most things in life there aren't any easy answers.

Btw, since you are from Canada, aren't pets included in your national health program?<lol>

 

[wtrdoc52]

He wasn't complaining about paying for the meds.. he was complaining about the vet gouging him on the price and making a big profit off the drugs as well as his time and knowledge for the visit.

Exactly!

 

[wtrdoc52]

Few months ago my alternator died.. the mechanic charged $300 for a part I could have bought at Autozone for $144.99 I also paid this mechanic $65/hr for his time and expertise. I am unhappy about that.

[/QUOTE]

This is exactly why I try to use a small garage where there is a crackerjack mechanic I trust. There is nothing worse than taking your rig to a dealership, cause they are supposed to be the pro's, and not only get hosed, but have to bring the rig back for more work! I also notice, that dealerships now "invent" service needs, that don't show up in my owners manual maintenance schedule. Give me a private shop with a good mechanic any time.

 

[wtrdoc52]

Humuhumunukunukuapua'a]Yeah, I think he was perfectly willing to pay for your services...at least I am...I love Vets! But at the same time, I do save a bunch of cash specifically on the medications at 1-800-PetMeds and the like, as compared to what I pay buying those meds from my Vet directly. Oh no...I can see it now LDS vs Local Vets vs LeisurePro vs 1-800-PetMeds vs BP/W...

Bingo.. you got it. Ever tried to buy a product requiring a prescription from 1-800-PetMeds or Dr. Foster's? I suppose this all gets back to who is getting their ox gored!<s> Vet, LDs... However, medical doctors write you a prescription and you chose the pharmacy.

 

[wtrdoc52]

On the same point: When your dog will start having vomiting and diarrhea or will brake it's leg, will you call 1-800-PetMeds for the bloodwork, meds and an orthopedic surgery as well? I don't assume anyone wants to buy all the needed equipment to treat their pets at home even if they would know what they are doing and would have the money to buy all the equipment? Isn't it great that there is a business just around the corner that is able to offer me these services immediatly without having to wait? The mark up is not money making. The proceeds from it support the whole clinic so when you need it, we can offer you: Radiology, Surgery, Laboratory, etc, etc...... it's really not pushing pills to make a $

I expect to pay the vet for all the services you listed above. Just like I pay a medical doctor for office visits, lab services, x-ray's, etc. However, the doctor writes me a prescription and I choose where to fill the prescription. I realize the general public did not always have the option of buying meds for pets on the open market. However, this is no longer the case. I personally, would not purchase a pet med w/o a consultation with my vet. However, when I'm looking at a product like Rimadyl, where the dog may use 30x100mg tabs per month for the remainder of his life, the price per tab becomes important. The vet is still going to be paid for the lab work and exams required to insure the safe use of this product.

Btw, I would never assume that you or any vet is "pushing" meds to make money. But, I have no doubt the Vet med mfg reps take good care of the vets who buy their products.

 

[dlndavid]

Thanks for your answers Scott. It's really apreciated that someone in the industry is honest enough to talk about that publicly. I still won't buy from the LDS (and will not feel bad), simply because their prices are ridiculous. It's not the customers duty to keep the LDS alive, but the LDS to give a good service to the customer, so he will come back, and bring his friends with him. All that said, I will buy from an authorized dealer for sure the next time....probably scubatoys!

Hope you enjoy your new BC.

BTW: Your thread has been hijacked big time.

 

[Bison Ravi]

Wow! I'm impressed about the popularity of the thread! I guess we all learned something from this discussion. What I realised (thanks Scott) is that if the LDS bankrupt, its not beacause of the big companies like zeagle. It's only because LDS owners are much more qualified in diving than in marketing. It's sad, but they are the only ones responsibles for their problems. Larry at scubatoys is a good example of what the other LDS owners should do: ADAPT to the new market. Concerning LeisurePro: they are not the new incarnaton of the devil. They are just offering what everyone wants: good products, wide selection of products, good price, and decent service. And they are quite good at what they do. I received my order yesterday (a couple days late). Everything was well packed, brand new, and exactly what I had ordered. In the evening I went to the local pool and everything is in perfect working order. I'm leaving for a trip in thailand december 28th, and will give you a review of the gear I bought when I'll come back (february).
Next time I will be shopping, the only thing I will do differently, will be to give a chance to Scubatoys (or other smart diving shops) to give me a quote, and then decide. If the price/product is close or the same that LP, I will be more than happy to give them my business.