Ice Diving

[Erich S]

Do you all think that Ice diving certification should come under the classification of tech diving?
I think it has a lot of similarities such as being in an overhead environment for example.

 

[shurite7]

We don't consider it technical diving, even though I have tech trimix certifications. It is overhead an overhead environment and requires additional training as well as plenty of logistics.

Depending on who and where you dive will determine if you are tethered or not. The university group goes to the Antarctica for research and the divers are not tethered. They don't consider ice diving technical

 

[kafkaland]

I did the PADI ice course, and it didn't really have a technical flavor to it. For me, technical diving is characterized by the need to solve all problems underwater, because you don't have access to the surface. The way we did our ice dives, we used a tether with a surface line tender. And in case of a problem you would signal the tender to just reel you in. So no real underwater problem solving with redundant everything needed.

 

[tilikum]

Why not tethered? I thought all ice diving was?

 

[shurite7]

Most ice diving is tethered. Up here in the murky lakes we are always tethered. I do know of a group who like to dive a small wreck in fairly shallow water where two lines are tied onto the wreck, one aft and the other the bow, and lead up to the hole. The divers then go down un-tethered; they can use the two lines if need be for decent or ascent. This of course applies to only experienced divers with really good buoyancy, navigation skills, and excellent situational awareness abilities.

At McMurdo Station the divers swim quite a ways from the hole (farther than 130 feet) and dive down to 90-100 feet on some dives. A line with a light is dropped down to mark the hole. Each diver is required to have good situational awareness and excellent navigation skills. The viz is really good in McMurdo, up to a few hundred feet, which allows the divers to see the hole from quite a distance.

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

If done properly then yes it should be classified as a technical dive course due to the following reasons:

1. Divers do not have direct access to the surface just like decompression divers or cave divers. This means that a properly conducted ice diving course should teach divers to handle gear malfunctions without surfacing just like technical divers.

2. A redundant air-source is essential. I prefer doubles so an ice diver should either be trained in the use of doubles with valve drills and what not or they should be trained in the use of a bail out bottle. Any situation where getting into additional bottles or doubles is necessary is where the line between recreational and technical training is even blurier.

3. You need a drysuit. One loan dive can be done in a thick wetsuit but that is a "Blah" dive. If you want to be an ice diver diving under ice every season then you need a drysuit.

Putting it all together, before you show up for an ice course you should be trained in the use of back-plate and wing with doubles or a safety bottle. You should also be drysuit proficient. If you show up in the class trying to learn these skills then it will be too much task loading. If you are not trained in this then the training needed would be pretty close to Intro to Tech OR Fundamentals of Tech.

Problem is that agencies want recreational shops and instructors to be able to teach it so people are going under ice in BCDs overloaded with weight as they are in 7mm wetsuits. As long as it is sold to the public as a "one time experience" rather than a life long skill, its seriousness will not be appreciated and since divers may get the card and never come back, it may not kill people in enough numbers for the courses deficiency to be addressed.

 

[stuartv]

If done properly then yes it should be classified as a technical dive course due to the following reasons:

Do you think Cavern should also be considered technical diving? If not, what is the difference?

Maybe there should be "Ice Diving" (which is tethered) that is "recreational/sport" and "Advanced Ice Diving" (i.e. untethered) that is "technical"?

 

[rhwestfall]

FWIW - SDI/TDI does not consider ice diving as "Technical" (nor is Solo) and is on the SDI side, but Cavern is, and is under the TDI side...

 

[stuartv]

FWIW - SDI/TDI does not consider ice diving as "Technical" (nor is Solo) and is on the SDI side, but Cavern is, and is under the TDI side...

Yep, and I don't really get that. Not sure why SDI doesn't have a Cavern cert. Seems analogous to Wreck, where Wreck is SDI and Adv Wreck is TDI. Seems like Ice and Cavern would be under SDI and they would have Adv Ice under TDI, alongside the Cave certs and Adv Wreck.

 

[kafkaland]

Do you think Cavern should also be considered technical diving? If not, what is the difference?

Maybe there should be "Ice Diving" (which is tethered) that is "recreational/sport" and "Advanced Ice Diving" (i.e. untethered) that is "technical"?

I think you're onto something here. It's well understood that there is "PADI Cavern" that does not allow doubles/sidemount and OOA drills in the overhead, and "Technical agency Cavern" that encourages or even requires this. Perhaps something similar for ice?