Mares Regulator Persistent Problems

[SSharkk]

I have had a Mares Proton ICE that I bought new some years ago. Ever since the initial purchase the thing has had problems leaking air and free flowing. It has been serviced by the local dive shop where I purchased it several times and I have sent it back to Mares in the USA to have it overhauled.

It works for brief periods of time then starts leaking again. I had it overhauled one last time, dove it once without a problem, then purchased an Aqua Lung Conshelf XIV which has worked perfectly through about 300 dives. I sent the Conshelf in for an overhaul and broke the Mares out of storage as a spare until the Conshelf comes home. After 4 dives the high pressure seat utterly blew out on a shark dive.


Background information:


The regulator is hooked up to a tank, pressurized, sprayed and then soaked in fresh water while pressurized for one to ten hours. Both the primary and the octopus are purged a few times while submerged. This procedure takes place at the end of every dive day.

The regulator is used with nitrox mixes of 29 % to 36 % on all dives. I inquired with Mares and my LDS about Nitrox use and they both told me that it should not present a problem.

The regulator is not exposed to high heat or cold. The underwater environment is mostly clear water with little sand, silt or turbidity.

Does anyone have an idea why this regulator persists in free flowing?

Thanks in advance for your comments.

Jeff

 

[herman]

Kinda hard to determine what is wrong over the internet but the first thing that comes to mind is have you actually determined which stage is giving you the problems? I know you say the HP seat but since you appear to be sending them in for service, I wonder how you determined which stage is the culprit (as opposed to just repeating what you were told by a "tech"). If both seconds are freeflowing, then it's likely a first stage issue but if it's just one second, it's a 50/50 shot between the first and the second stage. Also, define freeflow, is a a trickle of air out of one or both seconds or a huge flow of gas and if so, out of one second or both.

Determining which stage is defective is the first thing you need to establish. If you don't have one, get an IP gauge to determine for yourself which stage is the problem child. If IP is stable and at least close to the correct value (135 psi +/-5) then you have a second stage issue, if it creeps or shoots high, then you do have a first stage issue. I dug around and found some info on the V32 which I am guessing is your first stage. It has basically the same guts are a Conshelf/Titan/Legend so it should be pretty stable. I am guessing here but if it really is the first stage, my bet is a scratched balance chamber. Those can do exactly what you are describing and unless the tech is actually looking for the exact problem as opposed to just slapping in a service kit, he will never fix it. If it's the latter, the problem will go away for X number of dives then return. Problems like this seperate the real techs from the factory authorized parts swappers.

 

[SSharkk]

Kinda hard to determine what is wrong over the internet but the first thing that comes to mind is have you actually determined which stage is giving you the problems? I know you say the HP seat but since you appear to be sending them in for service, I wonder how you determined which stage is the culprit (as opposed to just repeating what you were told by a "tech"). If both seconds are freeflowing, then it's likely a first stage issue but if it's just one second, it's a 50/50 shot between the first and the second stage. Also, define freeflow, is a a trickle of air out of one or both seconds or a huge flow of gas and if so, out of one second or both.

Determining which stage is defective is the first thing you need to establish. If you don't have one, get an IP gauge to determine for yourself which stage is the problem child. If IP is stable and at least close to the correct value (135 psi +/-5) then you have a second stage issue, if it creeps or shoots high, then you do have a first stage issue. I dug around and found some info on the V32 which I am guessing is your first stage. It has basically the same guts are a Conshelf/Titan/Legend so it should be pretty stable. I am guessing here but if it really is the first stage, my bet is a scratched balance chamber. Those can do exactly what you are describing and unless the tech is actually looking for the exact problem as opposed to just slapping in a service kit, he will never fix it. If it's the latter, the problem will go away for X number of dives then return. Problems like this seperate the real techs from the factory authorized parts swappers.

herman the tech who worked on the reg this last time said the IP was 175psi and climbing so he replaced the HP seat. When the reg let go this last time the Nitrox was flowing out of the primary second in a an absolute gush. I could not tell what the first stage was doing. Can a scratched balance chamber be repaired? Or should I just ditch the reg? I have Conshelf XIV that I bought new to replace the Mares when the Mares kept going to the shop. The Mares would work for a while and then start free flowing out of the second stage.

 

[herman]

175 and climbing, def a first stage issue. It could be the seat, Mares did have issues with them a while back but your last rebuild or so should have installed the new version which is the reason I question it being the issue.
If it is the balance chamber, it can not be repaired but it is an easily replacable part...$15ish, or at least the Conshelf one is in that range- no telling what the Mares one is but they should not be that much more if any, no need at all to replace the reg. There is a very small oring inside it that gets replaced during service (or at least should be) and it is very easy to damage but darn near impossible to actually see the damage.
The thing that irritates me about this kind of problem is the techs don't spend the time to actually find the actual problem, they just replace parts and hope they get it. Most of the time that works but if you have a transient issue or one that tends to get covered up during a service, it causes problems like these. Time is money in a shop and I understand that but you are paying them to fix the problem, not cover it up enough for it to go away for a short time. It's one of the major reasons I started working on my own regs, I have control of the troubleshooting and what gets done. I insist on actually finding the bad part rather than just shotgunning it and hoping.
If all else fails, find another Conshelf and stick the Mares seconds on it.