New (late 2023) PADI Tec Diver Program vs. TDI

[chrisjur]

As many of you aware, PADI introduced their revised Tec Diving program back in November:

Go Beyond with the Newly Revised PADI Tec Diver Program

The revised PADI Tec Diver Program has gone digital to address growing interest for specialized training to explore beyond.

pros-blog.padi.com

I have seen several posts breaking down the changes and the immediate feedback seems to be positive. I also found Michael Menduno’s in-depth review to be very informative:

The Way The World Will Learn to Tec: Exploring PADI’s TecRec Update

By Michael Menduno. The views and opinions expressed are strictly my own. Photos courtesy of PADI unless noted. This October at the annual Diving Equipment & Marketing Association (DEMA) tradeshow, PADI released a long-awaited update to its open circuit “TecRec” program, which was originally...

gue.com

There have been many PADI TecRec vs TDI threads over the years and my interpretation has always been that TDI seemed to win out among more divers. But I am curious as to the group's take on the current state of play given the new PADI standards. If I’m a diver looking to start my tec journey, do you believe there are significant pros or cons to either agency’s tec path given the recent changes?

Of course, at the end of the day, the quality of your instructor is the most important factor. But, from a pure comparison of what is taught and the progression through each agency’s path, is one now better than the other?

I appreciate that PADI’s changes are so new that many may not have had an opportunity to get into the weeds yet. But I’d appreciate anyone’s thoughts if you’ve assessed it thus far.

 

[inquis]

New (late 2023) PADI Tec Diver Program vs. TDI

FTFY

I think it still comes down to the instructor. The good ones should have already been aware of the current thinking, especially with regard to deep stops, gas density, and narcotic depth. The updated material does make it easier for instructors to teach it, and new instructors will also need to prove they know it before they can teach it. Therefore, the odds of finding a good PADI instructor will be higher than they used to be.

 

[chrisjur]

FTFY

I think it still comes down to the instructor. The good ones should have already been aware of the current thinking, especially with regard to deep stops, gas density, and narcotic depth. The updated material does make it easier for instructors to teach it, and new instructors will also need to prove they know it before they can teach it. Therefore, the odds of finding a good PADI instructor will be higher than they used to be.

DOH! Thanks - fixed the subject line.

And thanks for your thoughts.

 

[kensuf]

As many of you aware, PADI introduced their revised Tec Diving program back in November:

Go Beyond with the Newly Revised PADI Tec Diver Program

The revised PADI Tec Diver Program has gone digital to address growing interest for specialized training to explore beyond.

pros-blog.padi.com

I have seen several posts breaking down the changes and the immediate feedback seems to be positive. I also found Michael Menduno’s in-depth review to be very informative:

The Way The World Will Learn to Tec: Exploring PADI’s TecRec Update

By Michael Menduno. The views and opinions expressed are strictly my own. Photos courtesy of PADI unless noted. This October at the annual Diving Equipment & Marketing Association (DEMA) tradeshow, PADI released a long-awaited update to its open circuit “TecRec” program, which was originally...

gue.com

There have been many PADI TecRec vs TDI threads over the years and my interpretation has always been that TDI seemed to win out among more divers. But I am curious as to the group's take on the current state of play given the new PADI standards. If I’m a diver looking to start my tec journey, do you believe there are significant pros or cons to either agency’s tec path given the recent changes?

Of course, at the end of the day, the quality of your instructor is the most important factor. But, from a pure comparison of what is taught and the progression through each agency’s path, is one now better than the other?

I appreciate that PADI’s changes are so new that many may not have had an opportunity to get into the weeds yet. But I’d appreciate anyone’s thoughts if you’ve assessed it thus far.

I think the standards to become a tech instructor are important. Has PADI published those?

 

[cerich]

I think the standards to become a tech instructor are important. Has PADI published those?

hopefully has changed from a couple extra days post open water IE with a course director for $$$

But you and I both know that what it takes to be a tech instr has shifted to the same approach as recreational specialties generally in the industry over the last 15 years. If it's longer than a weekend and open book non proctored e-learning done prior then the wanna be tech instr will just find an agency that will do it with a more often than not BS self attestation of experience in whatever specialty.

Meanwhile, except CCR, there is no industry standards consensus regards tech diving, RSTC/ISO doesn't cover it .

 

[J-Vo]

I was recently told they made the tech "IDC?" quite rigorous, but haven't removed the self certification path, so it's moot.

 

[Vevera]

Some of PADI tech instructors that I met were great but about 50% had really weird or dangerous ideas (eg. insisting on reserve bladder for "safety" but insufficient gas planned for the dive) so be really careful!

 

[tursiops]

Some of PADI tech instructors that I met were great but about 50% had really weird or dangerous ideas (eg. insisting on reserve bladder for "safety" but insufficient gas planned for the dive) so be really careful!

Take "of PADI" out of this statement and I will agree with it. Lots of weird ideas out there...

 

[stuartv]

But I am curious as to the group's take on the current state of play given the new PADI standards. If I’m a diver looking to start my tec journey, do you believe there are significant pros or cons to either agency’s tec path given the recent changes?

Of course, at the end of the day, the quality of your instructor is the most important factor. But, from a pure comparison of what is taught and the progression through each agency’s path, is one now better than the other?

I don't see much different between what they offer now and what they had last year.

I still like the TDI course structure and progression better. Especially now that TDI is adding a Trimix 75 option that slots in between Trimix and Advanced Trimix, which are 60 and 100 meters, respectively.

For those that aren't familiar, this is the TDI structure and (to ME) important points:

Intro to Tech, or
Technical Sidemount
- learn to dive doubles or sidemount, with all the fundamental skills needed to be prepared to move on and learn how to do staged, accelerated decompression dives.
- does not add any depth or new gases to the diver's certifications. It is just doubles/sidemount and the fundamental skills

Advanced Nitrox / Decompression Procedures / Helitrox
- one deco cylinder
- depth limit 150 feet/45m
- no limit on deco time (deco time will be inherently limited by only having 1 deco cylinder)
- use up to 100% oxygen
- use up to 35% helium, if the Helitrox class/certification is included
- requires 6 dives whether Helitrox is included or not, but 6 is just the minimum. It can certainly take more.

Trimix
- 2 deco cylinders
- depth limit 200 feet/60m
- Minimum fraction of Oxygen of 18%. Unlimited helium.
- requires 4 dives

Trimix 75
- same skills as Trimix - can take this class instead of Trimix
- depth limit of 245 feet/75m
- Minimum FO2 of 16%
- requires 5 dives (1 additional beyond Trimix)
- final standards for this are not published yet, so some details may turn out differently than what I've written

Advanced Trimix
- 3 deco cylinders
- depth limit 330 feet/100m
- No limits on O2 or He %
requires 4 dives

So, basically, a rec diver can take 3 or 4 classes and be trained and certified for full 100 meter trimix diving. Intro to Tech/Tech SM is not required by standards, but many instructors will require it anyway.

The PADI progression requires taking more classes (and spending more money) to achieve qualification for diving to the same levels (potentially with more restrictions).

For example: You want to do deco dives to 150.

TDI: Requires AN/DP, and you can then do unlimited deco, using up to 100% O2.
PADI: Requires Tec 40, and Tec 45, and you can then do unlimited deco, using up to 50% O2.

Example 2: You want to do deco dives to 250 feet. This is the sweet spot (to me). There are lots of wreck on the U.S. East Coast in the 150 - 250 range, with many of the great ones deeper than 200. The U-869 (U-Who), the Andrea Doria, the Monitor, the E M Clark, the Oriskany, and the U-2513 all immediately come to mind as great and/or famous wrecks in that 200 - 250 range.

TDI: Requires AN/DP, then Trimix 75 (so, 2 classes), and you can then do unlimited deco, using any gas you want, as long as it has at least 16% O2.
PADI: Requires Tec 40, Tec 45, Tec 50, Tec 65 (?), and then? It's a lot of classes, or so it seems to me. A lot more time and money spent with an instructor than I think is needed (versus less time/classes with an instructor and a lot of time diving and developing the skills on your own).

I feel like the "steps" that make the most sense are the steps of doubles, and then 1 deco gas, and then 2 gases, and then 3. Wrapping depth and gas constraints around those skills steps makes the most sense to me. And that is why I still prefer and would recommend the TDI course structure.

 

[inquis]

TDI: Requires AN/DP, and you can then do unlimited deco, using up to 100% O2.
PADI: Requires Tec 40, and Tec 45, and you can then do unlimited deco, using up to 50% O2.

No, Tec 45 is 100% for unlimited deco. Tec 50 adds a second deco gas.

TDI: Requires AN/DP, then Trimix 75 (so, 2 classes), and you can then do unlimited deco, using any gas you want, as long as it has at least 16% O2.
PADI: Requires Tec 40, Tec 45, Tec 50, Tec 65 (?), and then? It's a lot of classes, or so it seems to me.

Since most instructors require ITT (and probably most students would benefit), your TDI path list should list it. That's 4 classes for both since AN and DP are separate.

PADI: 40, 45, 50, Trimix - the first 3 can now use light helium if desired. Trimix 65 is an intermediate option instead of Trimix (no qualifiers) if the timing doesn't work out. Same academics, same prerequisites, but has 5 dives instead of 8. Folks will have been used to handling 2 bottles from Tec 50.

Yes, AN and DP are typically taught combined. The 40 & 45 material is all very similar and sure felt combined to me when I took it. There are a couple dives that can count toward both, since the skills are nearly identical. (There's a limit on the timing when that could happen.)