"not a good enough reason"

[PvtStash]

Hellohello,

While going through posts I came across one from a novice diver who having wanted to increase the depths of his dives had been incrementally doing so, and as he was getting past 100' posted asking about specific procedures/etc. he should be aware of.

The responses from SB were for the most part spot on... "training is paramount, people die doing that, get the training and redundancy on equiptment"

but then I heard this...

"why do you want to go deeper?" "going deeper for depths sake isnt a good enough reason"...



Wellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll I disagree.

I agree that if one Wants to go deeper they should get the training/equiptment to be able to do so safely, but if I want to "safely" build on my scuba experience by incrementally going deeper thats reason enough.

I disagree with the "well theres not much to see so you dont Need to go..."

What about mountain climbing? how many die Every year (yes with today's new tech/equipt. its MUCH safer) climbing Mt. McKinley "just because it was there" ?

Thats what humans do.

Just because there's "nothing to see" shouldnt rule a dive out... Safety issues/concerns are for that.

 

[Thalassamania]

Here's the depth workup used in the science community:

Depth Certifications and Progression to Next Depth Level

A certified diver diving under the auspices of the institution may progress to the next depth level after successfully completing the required dives for the next level. Under these circumstances the diver may exceed their depth limit. Dives shall be planned and executed under close supervision of a diver certified to this depth, with the knowledge and permission of the Diving Safety Officer.

1. Certification to 30 Foot Depth - Initial permit level, approved upon the successful completion of a minimum 100 hour diver training program that includes a minimum of 12 dives.
2. Certification to 60 Foot Depth - A diver holding a 30 foot certificate may be certified to a depth of 60 feet after successfully completing, under supervision, 12 logged training dives to depths between 31 and 60 feet, for a minimum total time of 4 hours.
3. Certification to 100 Foot Depth - A diver holding a 60 foot certificate may be certified to a depth of 100 feet after successfully completing, 4 dives to depths between 61 and 100 feet. The diver shall also demonstrate proficiency in the use of the appropriate Dive Tables.
4. Certification to 130 Foot Depth - A diver holding a 100 foot certificate may be certified to a depth of 130 feet after successfully completing, 4 dives to depths between 100 and 130 feet. The diver shall also demonstrate proficiency in the use of the appropriate Dive Tables.
5. Certification to 150 Foot Depth - A diver holding a 130 foot certificate may be certified to a depth of 150 feet after successfully completing, 4 dives to depths between 130 and 150 feet. The diver must also demonstrate knowledge of the special problems of deep diving, and of special safety requirements.
6. Certification to 190 Foot Depth - A diver holding a 150 foot certificate may be certified to a depth of 190 feet after successfully completing, 4 dives to depths between 150 and 190 feet. The diver must also demonstrate knowledge of the special problems of deep diving, and of special safety requirements.
7. Diving on air is not permitted beyond a depth of 190 feet.

 

[victor]

Thalassamania
To satisfy my curiosity could you please expand on
"knowledge of the special problems of deep diving"
and
"special safety requirements"

 

[MikeFerrara]

Most of us only dive because we want to. Is that a good reason? Ought to be a good enough reason for diving deep then.

Whoever started the rumor that there isn't much to see down deep is an idiot. LOL In the ocean, you see different things at different depths so it all depends on what you want to see. On my end of the Great Lakes, most of the good ship wrecks are deep and the most accessible caves are kind of deep.

But...some people are more interested in the technical challenge. Their goal is the diving itself and it doesn't matter if they see anything at all.

I think it all depends on what you're interested in.

 

[Dave_Rapp]

I think it can come down to a misunderstanding, 'Going deep for deeps sake' to me means going extremely deep for the sole intention of setting a new personal depth record (I'm talking about those who will go between 50 and 60 metres on air, lacking both the equipment and training required to safely accomplish this sort of dive).

But going deeper to build up experience gradually should be encouraged if the diver wishes to do it. As an example, if I wanted to do a technical course I would need to add to my experience of diving between 30 and 40 metres, so I would then set out to accomplish a number of dives inside this range, some may have a specific objective, some may be just to reach that depth then spend a while and return to the surface. To my mind those dives would be far removed from going deep for only the sake of the depth.

 

[dboddy]

This brings to mind a simular issue that has bothered me in the past but I never said much about it. In the cave diving community you often overhear divers talking about the "cowboys" of our sport. These are the guys that often penetrate as far as they can and as fast as they can. Many do it solo. They tend to be frowned on by the general community because they are not doing it the "right way". They are supposed to go slow, smell the roses, soak in their environment. I personally don't care what your motivation is for diving or for striving to reach new limits. As long as you are doing it safely and not causing any damage to the environment, it's really none of my concern. I tend to go a bit slower myself and truly enjoy the team concept...but that's me.

We all do way to much judging on the surface...perhaps we should try to do it less when we slip below the water. Whatever it is that motivates you...just dive!

 

[battles2a5]

I guess my take on this is that current day standards in no way prepare a diver for deep diving. Your basic open water course does not cover air consumption rates, gas planning, or deco in any way, shape, or form. We also don't teach redundancy in open water classes. The open water rig and open water training works for 90% of people in 90% of the diving environments so this is easy to justify. Vacation divers that are following a divemaster around don't need or care to have the knowledge required to plan deep dives.

Once you get into more advanced dive training you begin to understand the risks, the mitigants, and the procedures that will allow you to dive to deeper depths in a safer fashion. Admittedly, I used to dive deep (160+) on a singles rig but now that I have gone through advanced nitrox and deco, I probably wouldn't do it again. You don't know what you don't know until you know it.

So I guess the moral of the story is go ahead and dive deep. But either take the training to do so or do the research. REALLY plan the dive, not just "let's go check out that wreck and come back". Give yourself the tools you need to return safely from the dive so you can do many, many more.

 

[SlowRain]

I certainly have no objection to anyone who wants to learn to dive deeper. The operative word there is learn. As was mentioned, basic open water training does not even remotely prepare a new diver for deep dives. For most divers, the basic course and maybe an advanced class or two is probably all they will ever really need or for that matter even want.

Guess it would be good to define "deep diving" would it not? Depending on who you talk to that could be anywhere from > 60' to > 130'. But that is a difficult catagory to simply assign a number to in my mind. 120' in a place like Belize is totally different than 120' in a place like Puget Sound...certainly not from the aspect of gas laws, planning, etc., but from the point of dive conditions. It's one thing to be "deep" in a place where you can still see the surface, and quite another to be in an environment where you can't.

Whatever the motivation to go deeper, whether that is with the purpose of diving a wreck that you simply must see, or if that is just proving to yourself you can, debate is pointless. What is not pointless is that deeper diving, and especially diving where decompression comes into the picture should be accompanied by training skills and equipment appropriate to the task.

 

[TSandM]

We all dive for different reasons. Although I may hold an opinion regarding your reasons, there is no absolute moral scale for judging them. If you want to do a 300 foot dive just to say you did it, more power to you . . . but it makes more sense to do it with the information and skills to do it safely, as otherwise you might not get to brag about it at all

On the other hand, there are even people who prefer their dangerous activities without a safety net -- solo rock climbers come to mind. They have a right to do what they do. One only hopes that they do it in the full knowledge of the risks they take and the mitigating strategies they are discarding.

 

[Walter]

While going through posts I came across one from a novice diver who having wanted to increase the depths of his dives had been incrementally doing so, and as he was getting past 100' posted asking about specific procedures/etc. he should be aware of.

The responses from SB were for the most part spot on... "training is paramount, people die doing that, get the training and redundancy on equiptment"

His method is much safer than taking an AOW class in which a diver makes one dive to a depth of 60 feet or deeper with an instructor who might only have one dive to 60 feet and is suddenly qualified to make deep dives.